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Visionary
Posts: 2026
Brighton, TN | Well, for those that are interested! If you don't grease that #$%%^ steering stem bearing or if it wears out, you my friend have a nice job ahead of you.
I pulled the steering stem and found that the bearing was loose and very little grease, then the race was rough and no longer girlfriend smooth. So, I set about taking it apart and replacing the pieces.
Made a phone call to long time associate on here Varolling100kRyder as to how he completed this task. He said its a pain, the dealer said its a pain, KevinX said its a pain, starting to get the picture!!!!!!
One method was grinding on the race to weaken it and then hit it to shatter it to remove it in pieces. Well, seeing as how hard steel is, I ground on it for hours. Then I hit it with a chisel, No shatter, just bent the sharp edge of my chisel, must not be of the cold type. That didn't work. Ground some more and then gave up on that idea.
Next option, according to KevinX, who shall remain nameless, was to weld a bead around the race and it would fall at my feet. Scared I might muck up the aluminum with all of my skillful welding, I decided to attempt this by welding a large washer to race and a long bolt and use the bolt as a slide hammer, little more thought and this would have worked wonderfully. I could tell that it was moving right after I started using the bolt, but I didn't think far enough ahead to figure a easy way to hold on to the bolt or put a nut on the end and use a piece of metal to slide up and down as the hammer. So after awhile and another beer, I decided I would put a large locking pliers on the end to facilitate my grip. Which worked wonderfully, race came out and I was tired.
Now to try and work on the bearing on the steering stem. The book calls for you to cut the cage and remove the bearings and the cage. Then tighten up a bearing remover tool on the inner race and pull it up. Well, I didn't have that tool. Everything I had seen or used before would lead you to believe that you can just lightly tap around the edge of the inner race with the nice lip on it to ease it off.
VICTORY HAS SOME OF THE TIGHTEST TOLERANCES I HAVE EVER SEEN!!!!
I worked the sumbit around and around with a small chisel and hammer and no movement. Got bigger hammer and still no movement. Got a BIGGER hammer and Bigger chisel and started breaking off the lip of the inner race. Dangit!@!!! So, broke out the trusty dremel with cutoff wheel and cut deep grooves into the bearing and tighten it down into the vice with soft jaws. 3lb sledge and 1lb chisel and great big swings and it finally started to move. Over an hour of this, my arm hurts. I got it off.
I put the race and the steering stem into the freezer for TWO DAYS. The race went in about an 1/8th of an inch and stopped with more than an inch to go. Sunofabit, 3lb sledge and long socket handle and a small punch and I managed to get it seated. It takes way more force than I have ever used to do this on anything else.
Now, I am down to putting the lower bearing on the steering stem. Frozen stem and 100 degree bearing freshly packed full of grease. I beat on that motherf@#$%#$% for over an hour and I'm not even halfway there. Started with a punch big enough to hit the inner race without damaging the cage. No luck, So, I took the old inner race cut a notch in it, cleaned up the top, turned it upside down and commenced to beating on the bottom of the old race to move the new bearing down. I just really suck at mechanical stuff. I may have moved it 1/4 of an inch, after an hour and my arm hurts again. I have succombed to it and have decided to get a press or see if I can rally one out of somewhere.
Hopefully you folks have better luck at this than I. I never serviced the bearing and got right at 66K out of it before it needed help. If you bitch about a mechanic raising his price after he does this job, you'll know why now, cause it is a pain.
There's more but I gotta go find a press. |
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Visionary
Posts: 2026
Brighton, TN | OH yeah,
Thanks to VaRyder, for taking the phone call and talking me into tackling the job!!!
Thanks to KevinX, even though I don't live anywhere near him, so that he could talk me into bringing the job to him for his economical cause. I sent him a lot of questions on this board and he answered them very discreetly and gently to my manhood of mechanical prowess.
Thank you gents.
Songfan you should be getting close to needing this procedure. |
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Cruiser
Posts: 161
Albuquerque NM | I was looking in the manual and didn't see that there are any grease fittings for the steering head, am I missing it? |
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Visionary
Posts: 2026
Brighton, TN | NONE there, to service it, you have to disassemble. You don't have to knock everything out, but disassemble you must. Then you need the special spanner socket to tighten it all back up. grrrrrrrr!!!! |
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Visionary
Posts: 1365
Central Maryland | Pollolittle... great post. Was ROTFLMAO. Congrats at almost finally succeeding at it.
I once did the head bearings on my VTX; they were tough... but I am dreading the day I have to my Vision's...
Edited by willtill 2012-07-17 1:56 PM
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Visionary
Posts: 2026
Brighton, TN | Done, I am not! |
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Visionary
Posts: 8144
New Bohemia, VA | Po - you pointed something I forgot about. I think I did take my tree to the dealer and he popped the bearing off. and pressed the new bearing on. And to think, I forgot that, that's why I was stressing out reading what you went through. Sorry pal, but if anyone do that part, take it to the shop to have them remove and install the bearing. The race, that's fairly simple to install. |
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Visionary
Posts: 1365
Central Maryland | When I removed the lower bearing off of my VTX's steeering stem; I used a dremel to cut almost all of the way through it; then used a chisel and hammer to exploit the cut and "Ping" the bearing finally seperated and was easy to pop off. |
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Visionary
Posts: 1290
Ruskin, Fl | Can you drill and tap a grease fitting while you have it apart? I would sure be afraid to by a used Vision with more than 50K on it. If other people's mind works the way mine does it doesn't pay to get all the service done at that point. If you add up some of the things I was told need to be done as "routine" it's time to trade it in for a new one. How much is a new belt and pully(s), all that front end labor and fork oil change going to cost at a dealership?
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Cruiser
Posts: 281
| So my question is, how do you know the bearing was bad? |
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Visionary
Posts: 2026
Brighton, TN | Steering became very notchy. When i disassemble the race not shiny new and lightly rough. The bike wants to auto center and takes a lot of input to keep it straight. |
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Visionary
Posts: 4278
| Smart thinking on the freezer sorry it didn't help. I wounder it you went to a rental shop what they might have to help.
I know they make all kinds of grease gun fitting but none that would force grease into the bearing.
You can pull your head light and air filter and reach the steering stem if you want to try and add some grease. |
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Visionary
Posts: 3773
Pittsburgh, PA | Can you buy the spanner wrench? |
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Cruiser
Posts: 92
| Your freezer will not chill the part enough to fit in to the part before it warms up, need to use dry ice. We use dry ice to chill all our parts when we assembly aircraft engine parts, which I think might have a closer tolerance than Victory if not the same. Wally World sells dry ice.
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Visionary
Posts: 1340
Gainesville Fl Home of the Gators | Glad you are almost done having fun.....Welcome to my world!! |
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Visionary
Posts: 2026
Brighton, TN | Thanks for the Welcome party, next time, can you get more folks together and a few beverages. I have started stating, there is a reason I'm a computer guy and not a mechanic. I enjoy the work, I'm not very efficient at it to make any money. I would have to pay people to bring Bikes to me, not the other way.
It is back together, FINALLY. Thanks again kevinx for your prodding and poking to get me through it.
I am once again AMAZED at the handling and responsiveness, after changing the upper and lower steering stem bearings, and changing the fork oil. I also got my new Lyndall Brake Rotors and Pads mounted up. Overall, very interesting and glad I took the time to do it myself and do it right.
Story I give my wife:
Victory Spanner socket $54
or
large socket $6
Lincoln Electric Mig Welder $500 to weld tabs on the socket to make the spanner socket above.
Savings - $48
I wound up saving $48.
Edited by pollolittle 2012-07-19 9:48 AM
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Visionary
Posts: 8144
New Bohemia, VA | Brian, I am standing and applauding you for your accomplishment, job well done. It's great to have folks like KevinX that tolerates and keeps us shade trees out of a bind. While I could have made a living from it after doing it before and during my time in the Army, I got stuck behind a computer and found that it's steady work without the headaches. I like doing my own work, even to my own detriment, but have learned what would be cheaper if I just took it to the dealer. Having done the steering bearing myself somehow makes me feel more intimate with the road.
Enjoy your beverage...well deserved. |
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Tourer
Posts: 499
Chattanooga, TN | Polittle,
I've got a few more miles than I had planned on having before R&R steering head bearings, fork oil change etc. I figured I'd attempt it this winter as everything is holding up well for now with over 30k miles on Black Betty. Trying to get the tools I need together and wondering if I need this item I saw at Rocky Mountain Powersports. It's a Tusk Bearing Remover. Do you or anyone else out there for that matter know if this would make the job any easier? Here's the link.
http://www.rockymountainatvmc.com/p/44/-/256/731/-/20342/Tusk-Beari...
What other tools would you recommend having prior to starting? Thanks. |
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Visionary
Posts: 2026
Brighton, TN | I have to go find the bearing race but i dont think that puller is big enough. Ill see what i can do for remembering what tools. |
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Cruiser
Posts: 73
Nor Cali | Call me silly...but I'd just take it to my dealer.
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Visionary
Posts: 8144
New Bohemia, VA | I just lubed my steering bearing again, it was getting sticky on me. It's not looking pretty so I've ordered a new one and the next time it gets notchy feeling I'll replace it. I just replaced the rear shock also, so its riding well with fairly new tires on it too. Man, this is an old thread. |
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Cruiser
Posts: 116
| I am at the point where I want to lube the bearing, what did you do to do it, I mean did you pull the whole assembly out or did you just loosen and then lube. |
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Visionary
Posts: 8144
New Bohemia, VA | It's basically one and the same. If you take the nut loose, you might as well pull the tree out. I've done it enough now that I actually was assemblling the bike in the dark. I had enough daylight when I put the triple-tree back in and torque the nuts, the rest I was a little blind. I've thought how I could do as you suggest, but I just don't see it. |
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Cruiser
Posts: 116
| I thought I would just check, I was thinking I could skip taking the bars off or loose and just drop it down but if that is just a bigger pain then I would just pull it apart. |
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Visionary
Posts: 3773
Pittsburgh, PA | Redd - 2012-08-04 2:14 PM
Call me silly...but I'd just take it to my dealer.
If i take my bike to the dealer. I'll be with out it for at least a week.... on top of the 15 mile drive up there to drop it off. Then back home.. then back up there to puck it up, then back home again. .. no way.. I'll do it myself and not deal with the hassles... |
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Puddle Jumper
Posts: 9
| By now we should be taking a lessons from the trucking industry and put some sealed bearing on there which should never have to be replaced even under the most demanding motorcycle use . |
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Cruiser
Posts: 103
Davenport, IA | At 28K, I recently greased steering head bearings during winter months when I couldn't ride due to weather. Took triple tree completely off to do it right. It's all matter of having right tools to make job easier. Most of time I would go buy the tool rather than pay the dealer. I still come out money ahead. I bought the spanner socket from Victory, cost a good penny, but sure makes taking tree off easier, and allows you to tighten with proper torque. If I ever have to replace bearings & races, that will require the purchase of more tools I will buy them. For all of us do-it-yourselfers, does anyone know the perfect tool combination, bearing & race pullers/removing and installation tools for steering head bearings? Type, size and brand of tools would be helpful to all. |
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Visionary
Posts: 1308
Sand Rock, AL United States | Arkainzeye - 2014-03-13 10:31 AM
Redd - 2012-08-04 2:14 PM
Call me silly...but I'd just take it to my dealer.
If i take my bike to the dealer. I'll be with out it for at least a week.... on top of the 15 mile drive up there to drop it off. Then back home.. then back up there to puck it up, then back home again. .. no way.. I'll do it myself and not deal with the hassles...
If I did it myself , it would probably take a week  I have my 99, I would just ride it if I had any work done on the Vision (which I haven't).  |
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Visionary
Posts: 8144
New Bohemia, VA | With the slim exception of some, I believe riders should tackle some repairs of their bike. I rate lubing the steering bearing a moderate - difficult level task. Difficult only in that it needs the spanner wrench for the steering shoulder bolt. There is ways around this, but I will not disclose this here. I made my own spanner wrench, however, I believe one could find it on line, or coerce the dealer to order you one. Given the frequency it needs to be lubed, and I believe it is necessary to inspect it as recommended, but it can become a costly endeavor taking it to the dealer for high milers. You can ignore to the point of it needing replaced, but you are also putting yourself to risk. When it starts to feel notchy, it will only get worse from there in a short period of time. At this point it may be too late to service and will need to be replaced. I suspect with the Visions we will start hearing more hollering about this unless they have wised up and take care of this essential element of your ride. I found this at my local leather/biker gear shop by Hot Leathers. I had to have it.
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Visionary
Posts: 3773
Pittsburgh, PA | just wondering.. what type of grease do you guys prefer when lubing those bearing ? |
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Visionary
Posts: 1365
Central Maryland | I use this grease on "almost" everything:
http://www.walmart.com/ip/Super-Tech-Multi-Duty-Grease-1-lb/1679524... |
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Visionary
Posts: 8144
New Bohemia, VA | Pancakes? |
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Visionary
Posts: 4278
| kmt27
look up Motion Pro for tools
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Visionary
Posts: 1365
Central Maryland | varyder - 2014-12-07 5:33 PM
Pancakes?
I said... "almost" everything  |
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Tourer
Posts: 482
Beer Collins, Colorado (there is no fort) | This is what my home made steering stem socket looks like -couple a bucks for the fittings & a few minutes with the grinder.
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Visionary
Posts: 1365
Central Maryland | ByteN2it - 2014-12-08 9:29 PM
This is what my home made steering stem socket looks like -couple a bucks for the fittings & a few minutes with the grinder.
THAT THERE.... is American invention and G.I. Ingenuity
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Tourer
Posts: 482
Beer Collins, Colorado (there is no fort) | As far as pulling the bearings-I've heard it's a bitch on the Vic but have personally never done it. I have a blind bearing puller kit from Harbor Freight that I use on the wheel bearings and would hope I could use it on the stem too.
http://www.harborfreight.com/blind-hole-bearing-puller-95987.html
The other thing I need to take a close look at is possibly drilling & tapping for a couple grease zerk fittings-I did this on my old Vulcan's neck & swing arm pivots and it made maintenance a breeze and extended bearing life.
Edited by ByteN2it 2014-12-09 7:04 AM
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Visionary
Posts: 3773
Pittsburgh, PA | I did the cheap route as well last night.. that was just a quick cut i made last night after picking up a $5 socket from autozone. im going to make it smoother and what not later.. but the nut only needs 29 ft lbs anyways...
Edited by Arkainzeye 2014-12-09 8:44 AM
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Posts: 8144
New Bohemia, VA | you did gooder than all of us. |
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Visionary
Posts: 4278
| ByteN2it - 2014-12-09 7:01 AM As far as pulling the bearings-I've heard it's a bitch on the Vic but have personally never done it. I have a blind bearing puller kit from Harbor Freight that I use on the wheel bearings and would hope I could use it on the stem too. http://www.harborfreight.com/blind-hole-bearing-puller-95987.html The other thing I need to take a close look at is possibly drilling & tapping for a couple grease zerk fittings-I did this on my old Vulcan's neck & swing arm pivots and it made maintenance a breeze and extended bearing life. That kit will work on wheel bearings. Will not work for tripple trees |
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Visionary
Posts: 4278
| The top triple tree bearing is sealed and will slid off.
The bottom triple tree bearing is tapered and you need a special tool to take it off .
http://www.motoparthub.com/NB_HOTOP_Designs_Neck_Bearing_Tool_Neck_... |
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Visionary
Posts: 8144
New Bohemia, VA | You're thinking about the race, I think the blind puller will get this. Last time I had to dremel it out |
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Visionary
Posts: 3773
Pittsburgh, PA | Im just glad i got that over with. now i should be goo for a while. i tried to include a little clip of the Cut $5 socket in action.. lol like no one here hasn't seen a socket in motion before.. i had to compress the living crap out of the video..
Edited by Arkainzeye 2014-12-11 4:30 AM
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Visionary
Posts: 4278
| Arkainzeye
post the video on youtube and then add a link to it |
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Visionary
Posts: 3773
Pittsburgh, PA | thanks john.. the video i made was very very small.. it was more of just a clip.. thats all.. just to show that socket i cut worked.. its almost not worth mentioning.. .. on my last post i see a file named smaller.mp4 i thought clicking on that would give someone the chances to see the socket worked.. oh well |
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Visionary
Posts: 1365
Central Maryland | Arkainzeye - 2014-12-12 8:36 PM
thanks john.. the video i made was very very small.. it was more of just a clip.. thats all.. just to show that socket i cut worked.. its almost not worth mentioning.. .. on my last post i see a file named smaller.mp4 i thought clicking on that would give someone the chances to see the socket worked.. oh well
Clicking on your smaller.mp4 attachment in your previous post does work. Thanks for posting it.
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Visionary
Posts: 3773
Pittsburgh, PA | wiltill , thank you for letting me know the clip i posted worked. i was wondering.. |
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