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Puddle Jumper
Posts: 23
Longmont, CO | I AM NOT POSTING THIS TO GET INTO A DARKSIDE DEBATE. I'M POSTING FOR KNOWLEDGE ONLY BY PROVING THAT THIS WORKS!
Yeah baby!!!! It works and it works very well.
Having researched for hours, days and months, what I found is that the 195/55r16 is a perfect CT for the stock Vision. Lots are running that with trouble free positive results.
If you run with a trailer hitch, what I read was that a 185/55r16 is what's needed. What I couldn't find out though was what rubs or is the issue with running the 195 and the trailer.
I could find absolutely no one out there that has a Darkside NESS Vision. Only a few Ness's even ran a trailer.
Since I worked with Bushtec to get the hitch to work properly for the Ness, I thought I could go ahead and try the CT on my Ness. With the lower suspension of the Ness I wasn't willing to try the 195 (stock Vision size) but rather decided on the 185.
I am not new to running a car tire on the rear of a bike. I ran my VTX for thousands of miles pulling it's own Bushtec trailer. I absolutely loved it and vowed when the time came I would attempt it on my Ness.
I am so glad I did. The tire is a Hankock Ventus V2 Concept tire. I got it through Amazon. $85 delivered.
I knew that the car tires should have 3oz of Dynabeads so I ordered them through Ebay. $15.50 delivered.
I removed my tire and rim, removed the sprocket, then took the setup and new tire to our local custom bike shop, Full Throttle Customs. Since they deal with those fat a$$ chopper tires I thought it would be a safe bet they'd instal my tire.
$35 and it was done. Funny when I picked it up. He said one word. "WHY?". I spent a few moments explaining. He seems genuinely interested. I told him if it did't work I'd see him soon to swap them back. If it did work, I'd see soon to show him the setup.
Anywho, got it home. I polished up the rim while it was off the bike, then went into getting her on.
Installed like it was the stock setup. You can see that the tires are very similar to each other (size wise). I noticed when I compared the uninstalled car tire next to the OEM rime and E3 tire, the E3 was noticeably taller. After I had the car tire installed, it was taller than the uninstalled E3. For anyone doing a CT install, tires are different sizes when installed and filled with air 
After all installed and buttoned down, I removed all the air from the suspension. I wanted it on it's stops (or whatever they are on this beast) like the shock failed on a trip. Down my driveway I went and over my "curb". While obviously stiff it felt great. Down the street and around the block I went. It felt less like it was on a car tire than my VTX did. IT felt WONDERFUL!!
Very little additional push required for a turn. It almost felt like it wasn't even there. Back up the driveway I went and onto the bike jack.
Nothing rubbed. NOTHING!! Aired back up the shock and set it on the ground. 
I can't wait to get her on the road. There may be a few weather delay days but soon enough I will.
Just a cost comparison
Tire $85 delivered.
Balancing beads $15
Mounting $35
Total: $135 installed.
1 hour of my time
New OEM tire: $235
Install OEM: $35
OEM replacement: $280 installed.
$135 versus $280 initial replacement
Bike tire 10k miles - Remember, I tow
Car Tire 40k
4 bike tires for 1 car tire
$1000 (conservatively) versus $135 over 4-5 years.
The look of those behind me on the twisties....PRICELESS
I ran the initial test ride at 35lbs. I know how to get the right feel of it so I will adjust and play to find my sweet spot. I expect I will be up there near 40 like I did on the VTX. Will see.
So, a NESS Vision with a trailer hitch CAN GO DARKSIDE!! |
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Visionary
Posts: 1365
Central Maryland | Cool. Good writeup |
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Visionary
Posts: 3773
Pittsburgh, PA | i would go through NO LESS than 1 rear tire a year.. some times i would have to get 2.. im on the SAME dark side year for two years now and it looks great! and what i Reall Love is..... the lack of hassle getting a new rear tire every year... aside from the expense.... |
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Puddle Jumper
Posts: 23
Longmont, CO | Today's proof. A video: http://www.vision-riders.com/bb/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=14960 |
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Central Wisconsin | The Hankock Ventus V2 Concept looks like it should perform well. I went through two 175mm Dunlop Wintersport CT's with a Hitch Doc installed. Dunlop discontinued the 175mm so I just mounted a Kumho Ecsta PA31 185/55R/16 CT, haven't had a chance to try it out yet account of winter. Got a kick out of your Darkside video. Oh' been having good results using a rear 140/70/18 Bridgestone Battlax up front.
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Iron Butt
Posts: 804
Perry Hall, MD | TheMike,
I've been riding on the same tire with a Hitch Doc hitch for about 20K miles. A few comments from my experiences.
The sidewalls are a bit weak. Try accelerating from a stop while turning and catch 2nd gear part way into the turn. You'll feel the back end squat out a bit. (another member has reported the same observation)
The only time I experienced rubbing came when I forgot to increase the shock air pressure while riding 2 up and we hit some rough road surface. Didn't feel or hear anything, but the burning rubber smell was very obvious.
When I installed it I also installed a stock Dunlop on the front. I put Dynabeads in both tires. At highway speed and caught in fairly turbulent air the front end felt uncomfortably loose. I experimented with the amount of beads in both tires and then removed the beads in the front tire and went to conventional lead weights with no improvement. I finally increased the shock air pressure by 10 lbs over what the chart calls for and went to 40 lbs in the rear tire and everything was good.
When the time comes for a new rear tire I plan to remain a darksider, but it will be with another manufacturer.
Enjoyed your write up.
Edited by lennyb 2014-02-21 8:59 PM
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Cruiser
Posts: 251
Mechanicsville, VA United States | Thanks for the info, I've had that same tire on my garage floor for around 11 months now and I've been scared to install it on my Vision as it's not a run flat but after seeing your video I think I will install it after all.....really sorry about your camera and thanks for taking one for the team!
BTW I paid the samething($85) for my C-tire but shipping was free, I got it on eBay and it came out of Arizona.
Keep it coming and be safe brother! |
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Cruiser
Posts: 241
Monrovia, Ca | You guys are crazy and going to die! |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 752
Broken Arrow, OK | LOL, probably! Nice write up Mike.
FWIW, the Dunlop 175/60/16 Wintersport ROF is still being produced, just not available through online retailers.
You can get this awesome run flat tire through Mini Cooper dealerships. I just purchased 2 of them, not long ago.
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Tourer
Posts: 573
Central Illinois | LA Victory Rider - 2014-02-22 12:48 PM You guys are crazy and going to die! We are all going to die, even you. The only questions are when and will you really live first. |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 825
, WI | Nice video!! |
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Visionary
Posts: 1229
Rancho Cucamonga, CA | okie vision - 2014-02-22 11:56 AM
LOL, probably! Nice write up Mike.
FWIW, the Dunlop 175/60/16 Wintersport ROF is still being produced, just not available through online retailers.
You can get this awesome run flat tire through Mini Cooper dealerships. I just purchased 2 of them, not long ago.
Thanks for the info, extremely impressed with that tire. Was sad when I couldn't find it anymore. |
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Puddle Jumper
Posts: 39
Reedley, CA | I do not have a ness but a 2008 vision tour with Bushtec trailer hitch running Darkside 185 55 Hankook tire
love it I have found it to work best at 50lbs pressure, also I did a lot or research and 185 or smaller with the bushtec hitch |
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Puddle Jumper
Posts: 23
Longmont, CO | Thomas,
Thanks for the tip on the front tire. I may go that route when it's time for a change.
Lennyb,
Speaking of the sidewalls, what pressure do you run? I've like about 40-42 in the past but that was my VTX. I'm at 40 now but haven't done much riding yet. Summer will be a lot of 2 up and loaded trailer running.
As for your rubbing, that's why I did the test of removing all air and doing a short ride. As far as I could tell, by smell or look, nothing rubbed. Maybe because I'm on a Bushtec hitch?
Funny you should mention Dynabeads. With my bike being a Ness, there were no weights on either rim from the factory. I just assumed it was like that for all the Vic bikes. The shop that does my tire work only use Dynabeads so there's never another option with them. I asked them how the tire was balanced from the Factory they said they didn't know but didn't look like there was any extra balancing done. Anywho, they put Dynabeads in when they did my MT's and I had 3 oz put in the rear when I installed the CT. I've never felt anything strange that I would attribute to needing more/less weight. I believe 2 oz was put in the front. |
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Puddle Jumper
Posts: 23
Longmont, CO | Cletisv - 2014-02-24 9:22 AM
I do not have a ness but a 2008 vision tour with Bushtec trailer hitch running Darkside 185 55 Hankook tire
love it I have found it to work best at 50lbs pressure, also I did a lot or research and 185 or smaller with the bushtec hitch
50?? Wow! It's got a max rating of 51. I never thought of going that high so I'm curious as to what made you?
You've never rubbed? |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 802
| TheMike - 2014-02-24 8:53 AM
With my bike being a Ness, there were no weights on either rim from the factory. I just assumed it was like that for all the Vic bikes.
I haven't seen any weights on any of the wheels on my 3 new Visions and the '13 front was so far out the handlebars shook up and down! I checked the bare rear wheel and it was out like 2 ounces even without a tire on it. Typical Chinese crap.
Marc |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 804
Perry Hall, MD | TheMike - 2014-02-24 11:53 AM
what pressure do you run?
As far as I could tell, by smell or look, nothing rubbed. Maybe because I'm on a Bushtec hitch?
Found the best pressure to be 40 lbs.
On the day that I experienced the rubbing we had already traveled about 80 miles with no issues. It wasn't until I got onto some washboard back road that I found a need to increase the shock pressure. From what I've read you will have a bit of additional clearance with the Bushtec hitch.
Best advice I would offer is that if you ever smell burning rubber don't look elsewhere for the source. |
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Puddle Jumper
Posts: 23
Longmont, CO | Thanks Lenny! |
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Ness Vision, trailer hitch, and DARKSIDE