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Cruiser
Posts: 129
Leander,Texas |  i cannot belive no one has designed a new antenna es-pecially when the current one only requires a connector plug . you mean to tell me with all us vision riders no one on here has designed a better antenna from your old one?  |
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Cruiser
Posts: 118
Capitol Region of NH | I was wondering if one were to purchase an antenna from Harley, you know the long whips on the Road Kings, and installed it on the trunk would that work better. I don't know how long the cable is for it and if it would be long enough to make it to the front of the Vision or not. It seems to me it would be easy enough to install. I just hope the vision wouldn't reject it like a kidney or liver transplant. |
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Cruiser
Posts: 223
Valdosta, GA | The antenna line is a single stranded wire, so you should be able to splice in a length or 20 gauge wire and route it to anywhere you'd like. I don't listen to broadcast radio enough to make it worth the effort, though...
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Cruiser
Posts: 293
Arkansas | (who thinks they can design a knew antennna. IF ITS GOOD AND YOU CAN PROVE IT WORKS ILL BUY IT!)
I KNEW an antenna once, she was a long, skinny drink o'water, who could really WHIP you into shape! She certainly wasn't NEW, however. She did receive well, though. Luckily, I never got ILL by it! |
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Puddle Jumper
Posts: 37
SE Florida | The length of an antenna is important they are usually tuned to 1/4 or 1/2 of the wave length of the signal they are trying to receive. As such if you want to move the antenna to the trunk the lead to the antenna should be run in coax cable to shield all of the cable length but the antenna itself. |
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Visionary
Posts: 1436
| Victory has an external antenna in the works. It will look just like the CB antenna from what I hear. In the mean time try some dielectric grease, it helped mine some. Didn't fix it but helped. |
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Cruiser
Posts: 129
Leander,Texas | OK im giving up and buying XM I hate public radio anyways....lol  |
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Cruiser
Posts: 231
Hampton Va | Sirius is better! |
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Visionary
Posts: 1436
| Question for anyone who has looked at the radio back. Does the radio have a standard radio jack lead hole? I know what they have done for the hidden antenna in the front, I have been letting my dealer work from there. So does the radio itself have a regular automotive style jack, is what I'm asking... ????? |
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Visionary
Posts: 3006
San Antonio, TX | Yes the jack is a standard automotive antenna jack. At least it looked like one to me. |
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Cruiser
Posts: 223
Valdosta, GA | Yeah, but it's a push on, not a screw on. |
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Tourer
Posts: 353
| Has anyone tried an antenna booster? http://www.sportsimportsltd.com/20amfmauansi.html |
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Visionary
Posts: 3006
San Antonio, TX | I tried to get some time this weekend to work on the antenna and the radio but I had too much to do and to little time. I have all of the test equipment to determine if the radio is deaf or the antenna is weak or both.
The tests that I will perform are:
Check the stock antenna with an antenna analyzer. I will unplug the antenna from the radio and plug it into the analyzer then test the antenna for SWR and impedance on the FM band 87.5 to 108 MHz and the weather band at 162 MHz. I will use 50 ohm characteristic impedance first the switch the analyzer to test with the characteristic impedance set to 75 ohm.
Lookup the coax cable used for the antenna to make sure it is correct impedance for the receiver and antenna.
Build a reference antenna of the proper impedance to compare the Visions antenna. It will be a simple no gain dipole for the FM band of 50 or 75 ohm design as required and it will be tuned and tested with the analyzer for the lowest SWR.
Connect the dipole to the radio and tune around then connect the Vision antenna and repeat. Record the results.
Connect a service monitor to the reference dipole antenna and record the signal strength of several stations in micro volts and dBm, then connect the Vision antenna and repeat. Record the results.
Connect the service monitor to the radio and test the receiver for sensitivity on FM and the weather band.
My equipment is designed for commercial radio servicing so it will not generate a stereo signal but I will be able to get a good feel for the receiver's abilities on the FM band while using a mono signal. The equipment I have can definitively test the weather band receiver since this is a standard mono FM signal.
Perform some basic tests on the AM radio.
Finally the CB radio and antenna will get the same battery of tests as the FM radio.
I will post the results here as soon as I get them done.
FYI, adding an antenna preamplifier to the receiver is not always a safe bet. If the antenna is the problem then the amplifier will boost the signal as well as the background noise. If the receiver is a bit deaf the amplifier should help and not hurt. The antenna preamplifier mentioned above states it has 15 dB of gain but it does not state its noise figure. This is very important. An antenna preamplifier with a high noise figure can cause more harm then good.
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Iron Butt
Posts: 600
Linwood, MI | I look forward to seeing what you come up with when you finally get a chance to test all that with yer techno-voodoo-mojo stuff. radiotecher  |
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Cruiser
Posts: 297
VA | radioteacher, that sounds awesome. Please repost here, or make anew post, I'd really like to see the results after the test. I assume that the antenna is the culprit here. It doesn't look like they spent a lot of time in the design of it. If you come up with something to fix this, that would be one better. I thought about making my own antenna and experimenting with it. I like the idea of not mounting another antenna on the bike, so keeping it out of the way would be great. |
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Tourer
Posts: 495
Carrollton, TX | TexasVision - 2008-08-02 6:00 PM i cannot belive no one has designed a new antenna es-pecially when the current one only requires a connector plug . you mean to tell me with all us vision riders no one on here has designed a better antenna from your old one? In the Dallas area I get great FM reception on my Vision but have little desire to listen to it. I bet I haven't listen to FM more than 4 hours in the last 20 years. I listen to CD's, iPod, XM and sometimes AM. XM is so much better sounding than FM and the programming is great and going to get a lot better with the merger of XM and Sirius. The sound quality of the iPod is so much better than any other source I listen to it about 90% of the time. On long trips I also listen to Fox News on the XM to stay up on current events. |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 600
Linwood, MI | I too listen to my iPod almost exclusively, but I can't get Weather Band radio on my iPod. It sure would be nice if my antenna could pick up the local WB station good enough that I could actually hear what they were saying. |
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Visionary
Posts: 3204
Memphis | I put one of these in a Baja Bug and it works great. I mounted it to the top of the windshield (inside) but for the Vision I would mount it low on the back side of the windshield (where it's black). It's 14" across and you might have to weatherproof it with some silicone. I have XM and never listen to the AM/FM so it's not worth it for me to try the install. http://item.express.ebay.com/Vehicle-Parts-Accessories_Car-Electronics_Car-Electronics-Parts-Accessories_METRA-44-UA200-AMPLIFIED-GLASS-MOUNT-AM-FM-ANTENNA-NEW_W0QQitemZ140116930320QQihZ004QQptdnZCarQ20ElectronicsQ20PartsQ20Q26Q20AccessoriesQQddnZVehicleQ20PartsQ20Q26Q20AccessoriesQQadnZCarQ20ElectronicsQQptdiZ958QQddiZ1168QQadiZ967QQcmdZExpressItem Good luck. |
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Cruiser
Posts: 273
| radioteacher - 2008-08-03 11:54 PM
I tried to get some time this weekend to work on the antenna and the radio but I had too much to do and to little time. I have all of the test equipment to determine if the radio is deaf or the antenna is weak or both.
The tests that I will perform are:
Check the stock antenna with an antenna analyzer. I will unplug the antenna from the radio and plug it into the analyzer then test the antenna for SWR and impedance on the FM band 87.5 to 108 MHz and the weather band at 162 MHz. I will use 50 ohm characteristic impedance first the switch the analyzer to test with the characteristic impedance set to 75 ohm.
Lookup the coax cable used for the antenna to make sure it is correct impedance for the receiver and antenna.
Build a reference antenna of the proper impedance to compare the Visions antenna. It will be a simple no gain dipole for the FM band of 50 or 75 ohm design as required and it will be tuned and tested with the analyzer for the lowest SWR.
Connect the dipole to the radio and tune around then connect the Vision antenna and repeat. Record the results.
Connect a service monitor to the reference dipole antenna and record the signal strength of several stations in micro volts and dBm, then connect the Vision antenna and repeat. Record the results.
Connect the service monitor to the radio and test the receiver for sensitivity on FM and the weather band.
My equipment is designed for commercial radio servicing so it will not generate a stereo signal but I will be able to get a good feel for the receiver's abilities on the FM band while using a mono signal. The equipment I have can definitively test the weather band receiver since this is a standard mono FM signal.
Perform some basic tests on the AM radio.
Finally the CB radio and antenna will get the same battery of tests as the FM radio.
I will post the results here as soon as I get them done.
FYI, adding an antenna preamplifier to the receiver is not always a safe bet. If the antenna is the problem then the amplifier will boost the signal as well as the background noise. If the receiver is a bit deaf the amplifier should help and not hurt. The antenna preamplifier mentioned above states it has 15 dB of gain but it does not state its noise figure. This is very important. An antenna preamplifier with a high noise figure can cause more harm then good.
You seem to know a lot about this stuff which is a plus to the rest of us, but couldn't you simply mount a retractable power antenna on the front of the fairing?
Wouldn't that work well? |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 725
Reno County, KS | Radioteacher
It looks like there is already an amp for the FM antenna (by the scats). There is definately +/- VDC running to what the scats call a "powered AM/FM antenna". This one one to the first things I looked at. The problem; I believe, lies completely in the antenna form. It looks like they are grounding the antenna to the aluminium trim peice under the windshield, which I would beleive to be a bad idea. I had assumed that it was running a standard 75ohm antenna and was looking at replacing the whole thing by disconnecting the antenna at the radio and replacing it with one of the stick-on dipole type antenna's that GM had been using off and on. Anywho; just a thought. I'll be looking to see what you figure out for impedence on this before I replace the stock antenna.
BTW, has anyone else noticed that the AM reception is completely shot when you turn on the HIDs? Mine is, I'm sure others are too. |
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Visionary
Posts: 3006
San Antonio, TX | bigwill5150,
"powered AM/FM antenna" I did not know the Vision had one. I wish I had a copy of the service manual. When they put in my CB I noticed that they connected a wire just like the wire to the "front blade antenna" near the trunk from the Audio System Harness. Where does that wire go?
I will look into noise created by the HID light. Does the HID Light cause noise on the CB? |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 725
Reno County, KS | Mine is fixed. I posted a write up in the tech threads, if anyone's interested.
http://www.vision-riders.com/bb/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=1595&pos...
It did turn out to be a standard FM antenna. Although, I'm not selling anything so you'd have to go the store, buy it and do the install yourself. It's not hard but it is time consuming. I HIGHLY recommend service manuals!!! You could easily break something working on this bike without one. Especially since most of the trim peices are clipped on. I do not know if HID's are causing reception probs on the CB as I am a Street primo rider. My guess is probably so. I beleive the static is being caused by the HID rectifier, which is right underneath the windsheild trim peice as well. I am sorry but I am now getting ready to head back offshore. If anyone has any questions, I will try to answer ASAP but I won't know when that is.
Hope this helps
-Will |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 725
Reno County, KS | Hey songfan, I just noticed that we were on the same track with the radio antenna. That's the exact same one that I used to fix my bike! Works great! |
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Visionary
Posts: 1350
| JAM told me there was a post about a ground fix for the antenna. Haven't found it yet.
What I did find is:
http://www.dakotadigital.com/index.cfm/page/ptype=product/product_i...
It has good reviews and appreas it would fit where the stock antenna is.
On another note, owners talk about the speakers. Is it me or do they sound fine with a full helmet on? Of course we all know the insurance would make the test drivers where a full helmet at all times. Makes me believe if they did play music it sounded ok. I doubt they played much music while test driving. Like when you get your car back from the mech and the radio is off. He wants to hear the car sounds not the Tiny Tim MP3 you had on. :P |
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Cruiser
Posts: 266
Hartland, , WI | radioteacher - 2008-08-04 2:19 PM
bigwill5150,
"powered AM/FM antenna" I did not know the Vision had one. I wish I had a copy of the service manual. When they put in my CB I noticed that they connected a wire just like the wire to the "front blade antenna" near the trunk from the Audio System Harness. Where does that wire go?
I will look into noise created by the HID light. Does the HID Light cause noise on the CB?
I to rarely use my radio as I am an IPOD-aholic when on my bike...but love listening to my college football on a nice fall Saturday afternoon which means AM. Terribly sad the first Saturday on my Vic when I turned on the game. Lot's of interference and seemed much worse on the lower frequencies...but my service GM said that this was going to be a recall item when they get the answer hammered out...still waiting.
But the interference was from the the electronic signal going to the tachometer....anyway so I was told. But I really don't care what the problem comes from just fix it...if they told me the problem comes from drivers that are bald 50 year old a$$ wipes that are incompatable and to fix it you needed to wear a hair piece that you could pick up at the dealer...I'd have been listening to ball games last fall |
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Tourer
Posts: 495
Carrollton, TX | I have not installed this option yet but probably will soon. I think this will work better than any option Victory comes out with. http://www.vision-riders.com/bb/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=1595&posts=1&start=1 |
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Cruiser
Posts: 297
VA | Spock, I did this to mine. I can say it is a little better, but not what I was hoping for. I was disappointed. When I did the install, at first I thought I had gotten a defective antenna. Bought another one, installed it, and it was the same. In reality, and I know this in theory, nothing beats having a whip antenna sticking out, away from the bike and thus all the interference. Just my two cents. But, it's not that hard to do, and not that expensive, so hopefully others will get better results. |
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Visionary
Posts: 1350
| http://www.dakotadigital.com/index.cfm/page/ptype=results/Category_...
I thought this was a nice one. I found while looking for hidden antenna for custom cars. DD also makes one for the cars, 1000 model.
No idea how well it works. I emailed them what the difference is between the bike one and car one cause I only see cable length as the difference.
What I have read on line is that when the antennas (CB and radio) are too close together they cause interference too. That's why HD owners are putting the hidden styles in the front of the bike.
JAM said there was a post here about fixing the ground and that helped. I can't find it or maybe I misunderstood him? |
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Tourer
Posts: 548
Mount Vernon, WA United States | I initially wasn't going to post because I don't have a Vision, but I have had a LOT of experience in building and tuning antennas for radios in all bands. While based in science, it's somewhat of an artform. If someone is in the Pacific Northwest, I'd be glad to meet with you, and do some experiments and tests. All i need to be able to do is get to where the antenna plugs into the radio. I know I'm kindof out of the way, but I thought I would offer.
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Iron Butt
Posts: 965
New York State | You did mean to say you don't have a Vision Yet. |
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Cruiser
Posts: 212
Tavares, Fl | I installed the victory CB antenna along with an am/fm-cb splitter from Sierra Electronics. No help. They replaced the radio and now I get three fm stations, one am station and no weather stations. I'm half way between Ocalla and Orlando, I pick up numerous stations in the truck....I may try the under dash antenna next. |
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Visionary
Posts: 8144
New Bohemia, VA | rlreed, the antenna may not be at fault, it might be a grounding issue. I've got the stock antenna and pick up all local stations and even one that is 50 - 60 miles away almost the same as do in the jeep. |
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Tourer
Posts: 548
Mount Vernon, WA United States | Could be grounding or could be some other electronic interference attenuating the signal. These big V-Twins put out a decent magnetic field as well, but there is usually ways to isolate and work around. Also, temperature and humidity play a big part in all of this, and there are essentially no to identical situations. In cars and trucks I have seen where moving the wire organizer a few inches either way, or making a single loop in the distributor wire, or just adding a extra wire from some component case to ground, made all the difference in the world.
and yes Trekwolf164.... I figured "yet" was a given. Need to sell a BUNCH more FlashLights tho.... |
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Visionary
Posts: 3006
San Antonio, TX | All,
I am sorry that I did not publish my data from the testing I completed. I do not have the numbers with me but I remember the following.
The radio has a hearing problem on the FM band. It is not totally stone cold deaf but I was very disappointed in the receivers performance. The front blade makes a nice accent to the Vision but a terrible antenna.
I added the amplified antenna to my Vision as described in a tech note and noticed a marked improvement in the numbers over the stock antenna. The amplified antenna can only do so much to make for the deafness in the receiver on FM. The weather band showed even more improvement then the FM band with the amplified antenna.
Using the amplified antenna causes a steady tone on the AM band. This is too bad since that is how I listen to Sprus games!!!
In many ways I am disappointed in the radio.
My radio wish list.
Better receiver performance
Radio Data Service - RDS - Displays the title and artist.
HD Radio receiver - More stations
Memory slot for a SD card to add MP3 music without an iPod
Stereo input for the GPS.
External antenna for trunk for FM Radio
Mount for External Antenna on License plate for Street Mode
Ride Safe! |
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who thinks they can design a knew antennna. IF ITS GOOD AND YOU CAN PROVE IT WORKS ILL BUY IT!