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Cruiser
Posts: 152
Bonita Springs, FL | I live in Florida, bike was in garage while I was away for three weeks and when I got home I noticed the left side lower wind deflector laying on the garage floor. Lucky it fell off their. Any advice on the best tape to put it back on with. The tape that was on it was gray. I believe the 3M tapes come in different colors designating strength. Any advice would be appreciated. |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 802
Perry Hall, MD | Check out:
http://www.vision-riders.com/bb/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=1078&pos...
There was another thread that included info on a 3m adhesive pre-treatment that you should search for.
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Visionary
Posts: 8144
New Bohemia, VA | bolt them on. |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 935
Rockford, IL | This is from a post I did a long while back......... http://www.vision-riders.com/bb/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=1689&pos...
Having been in the collision repair industry for what seems forever I know some tricks when it comes to dealing with two-sided tape
3M makes a product called Automotive Adhesion Promoter. The 3M part number is 06396
Here is the 3M product description::
"3M 06396 Adhesion Promoter, 2.5cc per packet, 25 packets/box. 3M Adhesion Promoter 06396 is a liquid primer used for enhancing adhesion of 3M Acrylic Foam Tapes for interior and exterior trim applications. Specifically formulated to be used with 3M Acrylic Foam Tape for automotive applications. 06396 is often used with low-surface energy plastics such as TPO, PPO, PP, PC, PC + ABS, etc.). Since formulations and surface energies can vary for these types of materials, each application should be verified through testing. 06396 is supplied in an easy-to-use sponge applicator packet. The liquid contents of the packet should be completely used as soon as possible after opening. Apply promoter only to the areas that will be fully covered with tape. The primer should be dry before applying tape. For best results, apply tape immediately after primer application or no more than one hour after primer application. Be sure the primed surfaces remains free from contaminants prior to tape application."
Basically it is a small yellow sponge that comes in a towlette type package. You simply tear the package open and take the sponge and rub it where you are attaching the tape. It does tend to be a bit messy, almost a bit "glue-like". If you want to keep from making a mess you can use masking tape and tape off the area you want to use it on. When they say "completely used as soon as possible" they mean it. Once the package is opened you probably only have about 1.5-2 minutes before it evaporates. So you want to make sure you have everything ready to go.
You can buy these at almost any auto paint supply store. I've even seen O'Reilly's Auto carry them. About the only drawback is I'm not sure if individual packages are available, I've only seen this product available by the case. They come 25 packages to a case and usually run about $25-$30 or so. Which when you think about it...is a small price to pay to keep something from coming loose while cruising along. However I think if you ask the store maybe they might have an open box in stock and sell you one or two individual packages for a few dollars.
We use this stuff whenever we attach anything to a vehicle. Use it with nameplates, side mouldings, weatherstrips and so on. We have a Lifetime Warranty on our repairs and we never had to deal with something attached with double-sided tape coming loose.
The nice thing is if you ever decide to remove whatever you are attaching all you need is a source of heat, like a heat gun, and some fishing line. Clean off the residue and ready to go. A great alternative to drilling holes. |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 849
, FL United States | I took Lotzafun's advice and used the adhesion promoter and my lowers are still "stuck" on after aprx 25,000 miles. I just wish Victory had used a better powder coat on the mounting brackets, as mine have coat flaking off everywhere. |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 1109
| I guess I'm going to have to break down and install lowers. Hopefully the look will grow on me. These 100+ degree days are getting old and I rode a friends with em. Makes a difference. |
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Visionary
Posts: 4278
| I cut my aluminum panel with my jig saw and am very comfortable now. Wasn't that hard to get the panel off and do. Trick is use a fine tooth blade. Lowers just don't appeal to me.
Edited by john frey 2011-06-05 11:12 AM
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Cruiser
Posts: 130
Houston, Tx |
Ok..... need help! I purchased a set of lower mounts (only) from a guy and then purchased the color matched upper & lowers from Will (CycleOps). I've been trying like hell to find a quality 3M double sided tape that will hold these. I did find a 3M tape at Napa but not sure if that will work.
Can someone PLEASE point me to a quality VHB tape that will hold the lowers on? Also, if needed, as previously mentioned I'll use the Automotive Adhesion Promoter if I could get a link where to buy it and how to apply it. Napa couldn't find this stuff so they have no clue!! Is it applied on the mount, then before drying apply the tape? How about on the bike... applied on the fairing and then press the mount with tape already seated onto the fairing? Uuuuughhhhhhhhhh.... I need to get these lowers on now as it is getting way to hot around Houston to continue riding without these. Plus I'm tired of seeing my lowers and chrome mounts just sit on my desk! PLEASE HELP... web links would be most useful! |
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Visionary
Posts: 4278
| If you use any tape clean paint with rubbing alcohol to get the wax and dirt off |
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Cruiser
Posts: 130
Houston, Tx |
Thanks, well aware of that ... just need to know about the tape (which kind) and if I should use the adhesion promoter.
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Iron Butt
Posts: 935
Rockford, IL | Blue-
Have you tried a Auto Paint Supply store??? Check the yellow pages or call a local collision facility and see who they use. Heck, the collision facility might have some tape and adhesion wipes in their shop that you can buy.
As far as application you apply it to the mounts and then put the tape on the mounts and then apply to the bike and then install. Keep in mind the stuff evaporates fairly quickly so you only want to one mount at a time. You can apply the tape shortly after the stuff dries, kinda fairly shortly...like within a minute.
If worse comes to worse and you can't get you hands on the VHB and/or the adhesion wipes let me know via a PM and I can ship some to ya. However I'm going to out of town next Thur-Sun |
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Cruiser
Posts: 130
Houston, Tx | Thanks PM sent ...
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Puddle Jumper
Posts: 8
West Palm Beach FL | I have tried all the adhesive promoters etc drivers side still fell off as soon as heat got to it might take a week sometimes lasted for a month . Drill through bracket countersink hole Use a machine screw cut to proper length and they never fall off again.Gas tank on other side use caution when drilling! You can paint screw head black and make it seem like the factory should have done it that way. |
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Cruiser
Posts: 130
Houston, Tx | mikew - 2011-06-11 10:33 PM I have tried all the adhesive promoters etc drivers side still fell off as soon as heat got to it might take a week sometimes lasted for a month . Drill through bracket countersink hole Use a machine screw cut to proper length and they never fall off again.Gas tank on other side use caution when drilling! You can paint screw head black and make it seem like the factory should have done it that way.
This is all good in theory and wish I would've thought of it BEFORE sending the mounts to CycleOps for chroming. He stripped them down and made them look SWEET !! Just don't want to ruin the chrome but if they start to come off after I go through all this..then that will have to be the next option and I'll just pay the $$$ and get 'em redone. |
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Tourer
Posts: 432
Gettysburg, 2008 Tour Premium | The tape is a 3M double stick meant for outdoor use. I bought some a few years ago at Wal-Mart. At that time it had a red backing and was a very gooey gray tape almost like putty. I am not drilling the panels, for anything, no way. Of course mine sticks just fine. |
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Visionary
Posts: 1359
New Bohemia, Va | Not putting gloom and doom on this, and no I don't have them on my bike so as always I have no real input for anyone to be of any value. However, if I did put those things on my bike they would be bolted on along with the adhesive. Why? Because, though they may stick for a while, I believe as the bike is exposed to the elements, heat, cold and the FORCE of the constant wind against the wing trying to rip it off going down the highway at 80mph they will eventually come off. I admire all of you all that have the faith that this stuff will stick forever, or until at least you sell your bike, but I just don't trust it. If you can't live without them, do yourself and the next owner a favor, bolt them on and don't worry about. My final two cents on this one, I'm broke. |
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Visionary
Posts: 3006
San Antonio, TX | I had on the same set for almost 18 months. Even while riding last year with 60+ days at over 100 degrees they never came loose. Once last summer I tested them at the full rated speed of the tires.
I finally had to take them off to get some front end work in December of last year. I used a heat gun and some patience and they came off without leaving a scratch behind.
I remember reading a thread that someone had the dealer install them and they did it in 15 minutes. The instructions are clear that the bike should not be ridden for 24 hours after the installation.
My instructions are to wash the area in Dawn dish washing soap, rinse and dry. Clean the area with alcohol. Apply and let sit for 24 hours.
Ride Safe
Edited by radioteacher 2011-06-13 11:47 AM
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Visionary
Posts: 1359
New Bohemia, Va | radioteacher - 2011-06-13 11:45 AM
I had on the same set for almost 18 months. Even while riding last year with 60+ days at over 100 degrees they never came loose. Once last summer I tested them at the full rated speed of the tires.
I finally had to take them off to get some front end work in December of last year. I used a heat gun and some patience and they came off without leaving a scratch behind.
I remember reading a thread that someone had the dealer install them and they did it in 15 minutes. The instructions are clear that the bike should not be ridden for 24 hours after the installation.
My instructions are to wash the area in Dawn dish washing soap, rinse and dry. Clean the area with alcohol. Apply and let sit for 24 hours.
Ride Safe
Like my mom would say "mark my words"...
I believe that the real ill affect of the "properly" attached set will not reveal it's ugly head for about 5 years or less. About the time you think they'll last forever, someone will walk over to your bike and grab hold of one and say "how do you like these things?" and you gasp as it simple falls off into their hand.... or you're flying down the highway and you decide to adjust one on the fly....and it flys away. |
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Cruiser
Posts: 277
Apopka, FL | I followed these instructions using first; mineral spirits (thanks Will M.) to remove any wax, copious alcohol swabs, taped, let sit 24 hrs, then ran a fine silicon bead to the exposed edges of the tape. My rational behind that is I have eliminated air and moisture/rain from degrading the tape.
Here is a link to some photos I took of the application posted on www.theVMC.com;
http://forums.thevmc.com/bb/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=104887&p...
Edited by DrDecay 2011-06-13 11:21 PM
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Visionary
Posts: 3006
San Antonio, TX | Nice job! I am wondering if pressure washing is contributing to the issue on those that fall off. I hand wash my bike on the rare occasions that it gets a bath.
Ride Safe |
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Cruiser
Posts: 130
Houston, Tx | DrDecay - 2011-06-13 11:15 PM I followed these instructions using first; mineral spirits (thanks Will M.) to remove any wax, copious alcohol swabs, taped, let sit 24 hrs, then ran a fine silicon bead to the exposed edges of the tape. My rational behind that is I have eliminated air and moisture/rain from degrading the tape. [/QUOTE] This is EXACTLY what I had planned on doing as well... figured it couldn't hurt to keep some of the elements off of the tape.
Edited by BlueByu 2011-06-14 6:53 AM
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Visionary
Posts: 2118
Pitt Meadows, BC Canada | varyder - 2010-05-06 1:31 PM bolt them on. OK Chris - I did it - bolted them on. After almost losing one on the Grand Canyon trip, I took your advice (instead of my Dealer's Service Manager). Luckily for me - my Co-Pilot has tiny, deft fingers - and was able to get the nuts inside the bodywork onto the bolts. I used 3/16 x 1 1/4" bolts and curved some washers in the vice to mold to the outside shape. Looks OK to me - and should stop me from losing them. Thanks for the tip (wherever you are...)
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Tourer
Posts: 494
Akron Ohio area | Mine were installed at the dealership.
Had to wait an extra day before picking it up and it about killed me.
No problems so far.
I do remember that the test bike i rode had it's lowers through bolted. |
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Tourer
Posts: 323
Troy, NY | donetracey - 2011-07-03 6:37 PM
varyder - 2010-05-06 1:31 PM bolt them on. OK Chris - I did it - bolted them on. After almost losing one on the Grand Canyon trip, I took your advice (instead of my Dealer's Service Manager). Luckily for me - my Co-Pilot has tiny, deft fingers - and was able to get the?nuts inside the bodywork onto the bolts. I used 3/16 x 1 1/4" bolts and curved some washers in the vice to mold to the outside shape. Looks OK to me - and should stop me from losing them. Thanks for the tip (wherever you are...) ?
This picture is great - artistically! I almost didn't notice the bolt. I kept looking at brick reflecting from the Vision. You must have some bad ass wax on that. Looks very nice! |
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Visionary
Posts: 2118
Pitt Meadows, BC Canada | You notice my TOES ???? |
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Visionary
Posts: 1359
New Bohemia, Va | It's even got the maple leaf - genuine canuk to make sure the flag is flying in a tech picture.... don, I had to say huh? about the toes, but then I went "ugh!"
Now I can rest at night knowing your lowers won't fly off and hit me in the head when I ride with you!
PS: do they sell "weed-b-gone" in canada?" 
Edited by Cap'n Nemo 2011-07-04 7:00 AM
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Visionary
Posts: 3204
Memphis | Grey 3M with 3m adhesive promoter. My lowers are set to "feather" at 85 mph (no clue what the torque value is). They have held on up to 125. I think the intense desert heat might make the tape/glue soft and weaken the bond. Nice bolt job Don! |
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Tourer
Posts: 323
Troy, NY | donetracey - 2011-07-03 9:52 PM
You notice my TOES ????
Yeah, nice sandals - LOL! |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 763
Anderson, IN (48mi NE of downtown Indianapolis) | Fortunately I had good luck with the stock tape that comes from the factory on the lowers. I followed the instructions exactly as they were written...cleaned the surface and let cure for 24hrs. At 3yrs and 30k miles they still appear to be adhered good. Hopefully I will be saying the same at 5yrs. |
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Cruiser
Posts: 66
Delray Beach, FL United States | This question goes to John Frey about cutting the body panels: Did you do anything to the exposed metal once it was cut before putting it back on the bike? and Did you cut both sides so they are even looking? and How long did it take to take the bike apart/put back together again? Thanks for the info |
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New user
Posts: 2
| Here I go - Nearest I can tell the original tape is 3M 4941.
My first set stayed on for 5 years. I was riding it like i stole it and when the tip-over protection was grinding the pavement, the vibration proved to much for the downward side. Teach me to drive like that.
Any way they have been the stuff so they are going back on.
I'm additionally going to try 3M 06396 Adhesion Promote during installation. And make sure i let it sit for 24 hrs before adjusting or riding.
Oh and some CYCLEOPS Black powder-coated Aluminum lowers.
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Visionary
Posts: 8144
New Bohemia, VA | Cherry, bolt the suckers on. I predicted 5 years or more back that the tape would last about 5 years. Look for the old post. I don't want a blade flying into my face if I'm riding behind you. |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 691
Manchester, CT | The tape to use is 3M VHB. Its what GoPro uses for their mounts. I've used it for a number of applications including my metal lower deflectors.
https://www.google.com/search?q=vhb+tape&oq=vhb&aqs=chrome.1.69i... |
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Cruiser
Posts: 117
Spring Hill, Tennessee | johnnyvision - 2011-06-05 11:10 AM
I cut my aluminum panel with my jig saw and am very comfortable now. Wasn't that hard to get the panel off and do. Trick is use a fine tooth blade. Lowers just don't appeal to me.
I love this idea JohnnyVision! This is exactly what I'm looking for! Lowers are just not my thing.... |
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Visionary
Posts: 1350
| 63,000+ miles and no problem with lowers. She is an '09.
This thread reminded me of a show I watched. It was about adhesive. Most of us recognize that big glass building in Dubai. Do you know how all those glass panels are held on? 3M Industrial grade adhesive tape. The tape flexes with the change of temps in the desert conditions.
Also remember that most of your trim and badges are held on with double back tape on bikes, cars and trucks. How often do they fall off?
Me thinks in most cases the installer did not follow directions in proper prep of surfaces. |
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Visionary
Posts: 8144
New Bohemia, VA | Good trivia, bad application. Your lowers on the bike is not a badge or trim, it's a wing. It has constant battering by the wind, in or out, and the adhesive is exposed to the elements around the edge. I would agree, some may never fall off, but I think the exception would be the lack of element exposure and extreme tempature levels or change. That doesn't fit most category of people, but it would apply to some. I'm just waiting for more to report that theirs too have blown away. Again, let me ride in front of you if your lowers are merely "taped" on. |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 802
| I have mine bolted on but watch some of the videos on this page and you could almost become a believer.
http://solutions.3m.com/wps/portal/3M/en_US/Adhesives/Tapes/Brands/...
Marc |
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New user
Posts: 2
Springfield, MA | I had lowers installed by my dealer early this spring, already pulling away. The tape is stretched considerably. In the tape's defense, I do ride almost daily at highway speeds and my poor bike stays outside 
I think I'm going to prep, prime, tape, and then bolt them on. If that feels inadequate, I'll silicon the outside edges :D |
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Visionary
Posts: 1308
Sand Rock, AL United States | We have the same riding habits and parking garage (outside) . I bolted mine about 2 years ago. |
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Visionary
Posts: 8144
New Bohemia, VA | ZZ, I've never had the lowers and even took my uppers off. but if you see from my post above, and on page 1 a comment from me is that I have always recommending to BOLT THE LOWERS ON. There's a few guys that will tell the tape is sufficient, which I agree, under the ideal circumstances. So even try to prove their point by saying that some airplanes are glued together. But I would say, not by a square inch of material. Sorry, I just had to rant about this again. enjoy. |
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Puddle Jumper
Posts: 33
South Carolina | When I put mine on I tapped the large center hole so the bolt goes in from the backside. I marked the hole on the mounting template and used it to drill the holes. I still used the adhesive to hold them in place while i put the bolts in. Blue loctite with a star lockwasher. I didn't have problems geting my hands into the back. |
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