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Iron Butt
Posts: 741
Central New York | How about some opinions, facts, and data on headlamp modulators. I don't recall ever seeing one around these parts (upstate NY) so I can't make an informed decision on whether I want one. It doesn't make the bike go faster, farther, smoother. Can't be classified as "bling", I don't get to see it or feel it. So why? Will it make me live longer? Anyway: 1. Is there any proof or reliable testimony that they help ride safe? 2. Are they a pain in the butt? (something else to remember to turn on and off, etc.) 3. Do they destroy headlight bulbs? 4. Are they bad for the Vision? (do they send the stator or regulator into a tissy, do they wipe or the radio, cancel the signals or cruise control) 5. Do they make the bike look like crap? 6. Are some better than others? 7. What is a good one for the Vision? 8. Does anyone have a long term (miles or years) track record with one? And can we please keep this thread about headlamp modulators and not insert the "o--" word "f-----" word, or "t---" word. Thanks! 
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Visionary
Posts: 8144
New Bohemia, VA | Please, let's don't talk about these either. Saw one on the way across the plains of Kansas and I was glad I finally passed it. I don't think he had to avoid less hazards because of it. Oh yeah, that's right he had the over tractor trailer from the wind on his side, but I don't think it helped him get around it. I'm sure those who had him in his rearview mirror was glad to see him pass. By the way, he was a BMW rider, Mr. Safety with his bright orange vest. I guess every little bit helps though. Now you know how I feel about it, and gives folks points to argue against. I just hope every rider realizes and rides like nobody sees you, that is the safest way to ride. It saved me when the idiot slowed in the hammer lane to make an illegial U-turn on the emergency cross over on the interstate. | |
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Tourer
Posts: 492
Indianapolis, IN | Have one on my other bike, rarely use it unless I just feel like people are trying to kill me. I do believe they can be very annoying for other drivers and maybe even a distraction. That doesn't sound very safe. Some people coming toward you will display there frustrations with you by flashing their brights on and off until they are past you. Others get scared or annoyed and get out of your way and let you pass when you are approaching from behind. I've even had them pull off the road to let me go by. BTW I don't think this is a good idea even if it works out for the motorcyclist.
I've had no issues with the bike handling it. I have heard some cops will give you a hard way to go. Some have even had to resort to carrying copies of state laws stating that modulators are legal in order to avoid a ticket when stopped.
I think I would add more standard lighting, say fog lights, before I would put a modulator on my Vis.
Next.................. | |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 935
Rockford, IL | I did some research on these a while back and about the only thing I found was folks bragging about how cagers pull over for them. Personally I don't want cagers doing this in front of me, my luck will have them slamming on brakes prior to pulling over.
I couldn't find any independent studies showing any actual benefits. I think these are on of those "I spent the money so therefore it has to work" type things. And I think I will continue to think this until someone shows me some actual proof otherwise. | |
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Tourer
Posts: 447
Cleveland, GA | I have them on my Honda Shadow. In two years and 40,000 miles, I had a modulator on it for the last 35,000. I had NO ONE pull out in front of me the entire time with a modulator. Several did before the modulator was installed. Can't say the modulator made them aware enough to not pull out in front of me, but I have never had a problem with people pulling out with them on. All I can say is that I am a firm believer in headlight modulators. No one has ever pulled over for me because of it either.
I have considered adding one to my Vision, but the headlight is enough of a PITA to change without adding the modulator behind the bulb, so I don't know yet. Between the headlight on bright, the HID light, the driving lights, and the huge orange running lights on front, I think they see me pretty well. | |
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Tourer
Posts: 523
seattle, wa | I don't have any facts or data, but my opinion is, they should't be allowed. I believe only emergency vehicles should have flashing lights. | |
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Visionary
Posts: 8144
New Bohemia, VA | Lone Ranger, one thing I did notice today and there was a lot of bikes out and I saw one Vision behind me, it was the brightest, yet not too bright of a light. I saw a Ice Blue yesterday and I noticed it a far off and keep watching to see what had such a good headlight, of course it was a Vision.
No one can argue your personal experience, however, I think the Vision has the niche on getting noticed long before you see what it is. | |
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Cruiser
Posts: 184
Allen Park, MI | varyder - 2010-06-27 12:55 AM
Lone Ranger, one thing I did notice today and there was a lot of bikes out and I saw one Vision behind me, it was the brightest, yet not too bright of a light. I saw a Ice Blue yesterday and I noticed it a far off and keep watching to see what had such a good headlight, of course it was a Vision.
No one can argue your personal experience, however, I think the Vision has the niche on getting noticed long before you see what it is.
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Cruiser
Posts: 204
guelph ontario | Had one on my old GW and I thought it was effective -never had issues with any complaints and felt it increased frontal visability. Once had a copper stop me-he said he wanted to see what the devise was and he said it was very visable and thought it was a good idea. Dont have one on Vision but have small driving lamps which give lots of frontal visability. Used to have what was called a Cyberlight on the back of the GW which activated on breaking-the faster and harder you braked the faster and brighter it would flash. Havent seen one of these in years and if they still made them would get one. Better than the flashers for brake lights that are available now. Back in 1980 it cost 150 bucks so it was fairly expensive for the time. | |
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Puddle Jumper
Posts: 25
Illinois | I just had the modulator installed on my vision and it was definitely worth the $60!!! It's is very visible and it's all about SAFETY! | |
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Tourer
Posts: 499
Chattanooga, TN | A few days ago, a friend of mine was put on the prayer list. Glen is an older guy who I've ridden with quite a few times. He has a 2008 HD Electraglide UltraClassic. Damn cager pulled out in front of him as he was going down the road. He said the guy looked straight at him and Glen could see his eyes, but he pulled out anyway. No way to miss a copper and black ultra, and the guy who pulled out went to check on him, and told him he rode a bike as well. He was "really sorry, mister". Glen has a fractured pelvis, right thumb, and swollen knee(they don't know any more about the knee yet).
I don't give a flyin' f if someone pulls over to the side for me, thinking I'm an emergency vehicle. Bakfixr, what brand modulator do you have, and what kind of PITA was it to install? | |
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Puddle Jumper
Posts: 18
Northeast Ohio | I would like to cover your questions from a point of fact and almost 10 years of use of Kisan headlight modulators on numerous motorcycles. I have exclusively used Kisan brand ( I don't work for Kisan or sell their products), so my response will be tailored to that product exclusively. I currently have the Kisan headlight modulator installed on my 2010 Vision Tour.
1- There is no documented proof that I found that headlight modulators will help you ride safe. From my experience in thousands and thousands of miles, I am VERY confident that headlight (and taillight) modulators have made me MUCH more visible to cars and drivers. Flicking them on and off while you are waiting at an intersection with a left turning car in front of you will make the soccer mom on the cell phone notice you for sure, I've proved that to my self MANY times doing it. Have I had cars pull over for me? Sure, a coupe of times a summer it happens, no big deal.
2- They are not a pain in the butt. I put them on my high beams and don't worry about it. I will turn them off when I'm not leading a pack of other riders. As a matter of fact, another use for them is that if I'm not leading a ride and in the back of a line of bikes, I will turn them on when a fuel or bathroom stop is needed and the ride leader knows this. I will also use them if I get caught at a traffic light when the rest of the pack gets through. Very effective
3- I've not had a bulb failure in all the motorcycles I've used the Kisan modulators on. You need to be VERY careful on installation about touching the bulbs. If you do touch the bulbs without proper cleaning, they will burn out fast.
4- Not bad for the Vision at all. I do not have them hooked into the HID light, just the two regular lights. No radio interference, no flickering dash lights, no problems at all.
5- If you hide the wiring properly, along with the light sensor, nobody will know you have them installed at all.
6,7- I've only used Kisan, and never had a failure. I have no experience with the other brands.
8- Almost 10 years with the same Kisan product, many thousands of miles - never a failure. I am very picky on how I route wires, protecting them from chafing and pulling.
Some people say that modulators are against the law, I pass 3-4 police cars each day I ride to work and never have been pulled over. I employ a police officer and have asked him about the laws, he said no problem. I occasionally ride with a deputy sheriff, he says no problem, another friend is a state trooper, he says no problem, I could go on and on. I've ridden in almost every state from Ohio east, and never have had a policeman look at me twice with the modulators on.
If I find something that will give me even a small chance of staying alive on my motorcycle, I'm going to use it.
Now are you ready for the bad news? Putting the headlight modulators on the vision is the hardest install I've done. You will swear. You will cut your hands. You will be frustrated. Unless you have very small hands, it will be the most difficult 3-4 hours of your life, but it will be very worth it. Better yet, find a friend with the smallest, strongest hands and buy him dinner for helping you!
I hope this helps. If you want to send me a PM on some Vision install tips, please feel free to do so.
Good luck with your decision,
Steve DiFranco | |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 741
Central New York | I would like to thank everyone for such great responses. A couple of pros and many cons. However, I noticed that almost exclusively the cons were in reference to how they may annoy someone else, while the the pros focused on the benefits to ones self. My first responsibility when I get on my bike is to return safely to my family. In reading these replies I have to assume that a headlight modulator just might add to my chances of meeting that responsibility. After all, in 62 years I have used many of my "luck chips", I don't know how many I have left! 
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Puddle Jumper
Posts: 25
Illinois | I agree glighto11, it's all about making your bike more visual.... I don't recall the make of the modulator, I saw it at the dealer and the install took them an hour. It's wired to the high beams not the hid. There is a photo sensor which turns of the mod at night and also a toggle switch to deactivate if needed. | |
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Tourer
Posts: 395
Moravia, IA | I would also like to toss my 2 cents in.
Ive logged almost 5 years with a headlight modulator on several bikes, including my Vision.
1. Is there any proof or reliable testimony that they help ride safe?
Nothing conclusive. It would be rather hard to prove but I honestly believe in them as a safety device. Sure I may annoy a driver on occasion....but if I annoyed them, they saw me. Ive honestly only had 1 person complain....and it was a biker, not a cager. He got all bent out of shape about it and spouted off at a PGR ride......believe it or not. I do get alot of "hey your headlight is broken....its blinking"....again, if they noticed THAT.....they noticed ME. Ive also had a few cars here and there pull over....but less recently as modulator use is getting more common where I live.
2. Are they a pain in the butt? (something else to remember to turn on and off, etc.)
Nothing to remember to turn on and off. The unit I buy is pre-wired for high beam operation but can be changed to low beam if desired. There is an electric eye that will automatically shut the unit off for you in conditions where you shouldn't run it (dark, very overcast etc). Otherwise, if for some reason you dont want your headlight to blink just use your low beams. Low beams no blinkie.......high beams blinkie (unless the electric eye deems it to "dark").
3. Do they destroy headlight bulbs?
Nope....not at all. They dont actually blink fully off and on....more like alternate between 20% to 100% power (Im paraphrasing here, if you look it up you will get actual percentages....but you get the just). There is no on-off cycling of the bulb this way. In all the bikes Ive ever run a modulator Ive never replaced a headlight.....never.
4. Are they bad for the Vision? (do they send the stator or regulator into a tissy, do they wipe or the radio, cancel the signals or cruise control)
Nope, ZERO problems.
5. Do they make the bike look like crap?
You cant tell its even there (except the headlights modulating). You could not find any evidence of the modulator on my bike....look all you want. It took a whole 15 mins to install. Unplug headlights. Plug modulator into headlights. Plug bike into modulator. Route electric eye somewhere it can "see" the sky. Simple as that.
6. Are some better than others?
They cant be really. There are strict regulations for headlight modulators. They MUST modulate between a certain percentage of light......they MUST have an electric eye that meets standards......they MUST fail in a way that allows the headlight to always function even if the modulator malfunctions. This is per the Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standards. Because of this I believe they are all fairly equal. Kisan units were mentioned above....I use Comagination units on my bikes.
http://www.comagination.com/
7. What is a good one for the Vision?
Any should work and be just fine.
8. Does anyone have a long term (miles or years) track record with one?
Ive got almost 5 years with near 50K miles on headlight modulators on Yamaha, Honda, Kawasaki and Victory motorcycles. I used them on everything from my Ninja.....to my Goldwing.....to my old KZ1000. Never had a failure, issue or problem of any kind.
Steve DiFranco - 2010-06-27 1:55 PM
Some people say that modulators are against the law, I pass 3-4 police cars each day I ride to work and never have been pulled over. I employ a police officer and have asked him about the laws, he said no problem. I occasionally ride with a deputy sheriff, he says no problem, another friend is a state trooper, he says no problem, I could go on and on. I've ridden in almost every state from Ohio east, and never have had a policeman look at me twice with the modulators on.
If I find something that will give me even a small chance of staying alive on my motorcycle, I'm going to use it.
Now are you ready for the bad news? Putting the headlight modulators on the vision is the hardest install I've done. You will swear. You will cut your hands. You will be frustrated. Unless you have very small hands, it will be the most difficult 3-4 hours of your life, but it will be very worth it. Better yet, find a friend with the smallest, strongest hands and buy him dinner for helping you!
I hope this helps. If you want to send me a PM on some Vision install tips, please feel free to do so.
Good luck with your decision,
Steve DiFranco
Steve, what was problematic with your modulator install? I literally reached up there, unplugged the bikes headlight plug.....plugged modulator in.....zip tied the extra wires nearby......routed the eye - honestly took 15 mins. There are no wires visible....everything nice and hidden. Im also 6ft4in with size 14 shoes and equally big hands.....it was tight in there but not that big of a deal.
Also ref legal issues. Headlight modulators are 50 state legal per federal code. It says right in this federal code that it can NOT be superseded by state or local laws. I carry a copy with me. I work in law enforcement......so far 1 state trooper and 1 DOT officer called me on it. I showed them the paperwork.....they confirmed it with the very large book they carry in the trunk and I was on my way with a thank you from them for the information. I highly suggest carrying a copy with you, just in case.
http://www.webbikeworld.com/Motorcycle-technical-articles/Modulator...
Edited by aaronrkelly 2010-06-30 2:06 AM
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Puddle Jumper
Posts: 18
Northeast Ohio | Aaron,
I agree with everything you stated.
I have pretty big hands, so getting them up inside behind the light pod was a challenge. I think a person with normal sized hands would have less of an issue than I did. I also wanted to get the modulator adaptors inside the rubber water protective covers on the back of each light fixture. I had to remove the air cleaner pre filter and the aluminum covers on the side fairing to get my big paws up and inside to do the job.
Once the adaptors were on, the balance of the wiring took just a few minutes. The Kisan unit came pre-programmed to activate on the high beams out of the box, so no other fussing around was needed.
Good luck and ride safe,
Steve DiFranco | |
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Tourer
Posts: 550
Tacoma, WA | I for one will never have a headlight modulator on any bike I own. Anything that mimics a LEO is not too good an idea. Try riding in front of someone with one on for a few miles. It is annoying as hell, akin to riding behind a bike with loud pipes. Just another un-neccesary item that angers the drivers around you. Not exactly a safe thing. If your bike has inadequate lights, as most bikes do, install some quality auxillary lights to make a recognizable "signature" that cagers (and riders) can see easier. The Vision has a great set of lights, with the combination of HID and incandescent lights, so it is easier to see with the broader spectrum of light than most bikes. A good set of low-mounted driving lights would be a better investment than a modulator, any day. | |
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Cruiser
Posts: 184
Allen Park, MI | I guess its all about personal preference....the last thing I am worried about is annoying any cagers..if it helps but just one person see me easier....mission accomplished. With having the ability to shut them off when riding behind other riders...I don't see it as an issue. Plus judging by all the positive responses...sounds like it is a worthwhile investment...just my opinion...everyone has one. | |
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Tourer
Posts: 523
seattle, wa | metalguy - 2010-07-02 9:29 AM
I for one will never have a headlight modulator on any bike I own. Anything that mimics a LEO is not too good an idea. Try riding in front of someone with one on for a few miles. It is annoying as hell, akin to riding behind a bike with loud pipes. Just another un-neccesary item that angers the drivers around you. Not exactly a safe thing. If your bike has inadequate lights, as most bikes do, install some quality auxillary lights to make a recognizable "signature" that cagers (and riders) can see easier. The Vision has a great set of lights, with the combination of HID and incandescent lights, so it is easier to see with the broader spectrum of light than most bikes. A good set of low-mounted driving lights would be a better investment than a modulator, any day.
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Visionary
Posts: 1484
LaPorte,Tx. | When going down the street, my eye is drawn to a modulating light, but I've notice, that I do keep looking at it, maybe that's why people don't like them. Because, while I'm looking at the modulating light, I'm not watching the road and the guy ahead of me. He slams on the brake, I catch it out of the corner of my eye and swerve left, right into the path of the modulating light! Damn, I didn't want that to happen...I really saw him too much. | |
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Tourer
Posts: 550
Tacoma, WA | Of course folks don't care about pi$$ing off cagers. After all, they don't pose any threat, do they? I have seen cagers light up the brakes for those who piss them off. Including for things like high beams, and yes, modulators. Totally not a safe idea. Better lighting is a better investment. Just my opinion.------Metalguy | |
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Puddle Jumper
Posts: 5
Albuquerque | OK, this is from memory, but, I think that it's pretty accurate. Headlight modulators came about because of a high accident rate by a Washington, DC based Motorcycle Courier Service. They went to the University of North Carolina or South Carolina for help. Thus came the modulator into existence. The accident rate for this Courier service was reduced dramatically - maybe as much as 90%, if my memory is correct. If it help cars to see me and to not pull out or turn in front of me, I think they are well worth the investment. Had one on my last bike, just put one on my son's bike and will put one on my Kingpin if I can - I'm researching it now. If I recall correctly the claim was that you could not - not see - the blinking light. I use mine in heavy traffic or when someone in my vicinity is about to make a left turn into my path or pull out into my path. YMMV. | |
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Visionary
Posts: 1436
| Ok my 2 cents. I've heard just about every EXCUSE in the book as to why one wouldn't run a headlite modulator. I've run the Kisan and others for some 15 years and wouldn't be without it by choice, BUT you do need to know when to shut it off.
Headlite modulators are legal in ALL 50 states, the Fed law supercedes any local or state as they relate to modulators. Brake lite modulators are NOT legal anywhere.
Modulators do not mimmic emergency vehicles whose lites FLASH.
I've only ever had ONE vehicle move over in all the years because she thought I was an emergency vehicle.
Proof of increased safety? Can't count the times a cage was about to pull out without looking and all of the sudden they stab the brakes hard. Had folks turn around and chase me down to let me know my lite is blinking. I have NOT had a single cage pull out in front of me, not one, while running the modulator in some 15 years, thats proof enough for me.
There are some don'ts like not using it on interstate (trucks think you are flashing them over), or in a bike pack.
So use whatever EXCUSE you want for not making yourself visible, but don't complin when that cage crosses your path because they REALLY didn't see you.
Just my thoughts....... | |
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Tourer
Posts: 576
, IA | Need. Some brandD links for a vision i ran one on tc and wifes old Honda great product
Edited by sonicbluerider 2010-07-09 8:29 AM
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Cruiser
Posts: 184
Allen Park, MI | Teach - 2010-07-09 9:06 AM
Ok my 2 cents. I've heard just about every EXCUSE in the book as to why one wouldn't run a headlite modulator. I've run the Kisan and others for some 15 years and wouldn't be without it by choice, BUT you do need to know when to shut it off.
Headlite modulators are legal in ALL 50 states, the Fed law supercedes any local or state as they relate to modulators. Brake lite modulators are NOT legal anywhere.
Modulators do not mimmic emergency vehicles whose lites FLASH.
I've only ever had ONE vehicle move over in all the years because she thought I was an emergency vehicle.
Proof of increased safety? Can't count the times a cage was about to pull out without looking and all of the sudden they stab the brakes hard. Had folks turn around and chase me down to let me know my lite is blinking. I have NOT had a single cage pull out in front of me, not one, while running the modulator in some 15 years, thats proof enough for me.
There are some don'ts like not using it on interstate (trucks think you are flashing them over), or in a bike pack.
So use whatever EXCUSE you want for not making yourself visible, but don't complin when that cage crosses your path because they REALLY didn't see you.
Just my thoughts.......
Well said Teach....couldn't agree more...I will never understand those that choose to bash others and their ideas just because they don't agree with them. I always thought that was the idea behind having these types of forums so that we ALL could share ideas with each other without having to constantly defend them?? Oh well to each his own I guess. Ride safe....live long. | |
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Tourer
Posts: 395
Moravia, IA | Teach - 2010-07-09 8:06 AM
Ok my 2 cents. I've heard just about every EXCUSE in the book as to why one wouldn't run a headlite modulator. I've run the Kisan and others for some 15 years and wouldn't be without it by choice, BUT you do need to know when to shut it off.
Headlite modulators are legal in ALL 50 states, the Fed law supercedes any local or state as they relate to modulators. Brake lite modulators are NOT legal anywhere.
Modulators do not mimmic emergency vehicles whose lites FLASH.
I've only ever had ONE vehicle move over in all the years because she thought I was an emergency vehicle.
Proof of increased safety? Can't count the times a cage was about to pull out without looking and all of the sudden they stab the brakes hard. Had folks turn around and chase me down to let me know my lite is blinking. I have NOT had a single cage pull out in front of me, not one, while running the modulator in some 15 years, thats proof enough for me.
There are some don'ts like not using it on interstate (trucks think you are flashing them over), or in a bike pack.
So use whatever EXCUSE you want for not making yourself visible, but don't complin when that cage crosses your path because they REALLY didn't see you.
Just my thoughts.......
Ive had the same experiences regarding cars.....and despite that I ride with people that still wont get a headlight modulator. The funny thing is when we ride in a group they put me up front so we are seen.....I guess maybe safety devices arent "hardcore" of an accessory enough for "real bikers".
At any rate tail light modulators ARE legal in California. In fact a few manufacturers make specific California legal models.
Deceleration Warning Lights
(c) Any stoplamp or supplemental stoplamp required or permitted by Section 24603 may be equipped so as to flash not more than four times within the first four seconds after actuation by application of the brakes.
Amended Ch. 410, Stats. 1983. Effective January 1, 1984.
To the best of my knowledge they are not legal anywhere else. | |
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Visionary
Posts: 8144
New Bohemia, VA | Prostreet1 - 2010-07-09 10:15 AM
Teach - 2010-07-09 9:06 AM
Ok my 2 cents. I've heard just about every EXCUSE in the book as to why one wouldn't run a headlite modulator. I've run the Kisan and others for some 15 years and wouldn't be without it by choice, BUT you do need to know when to shut it off.
Headlite modulators are legal in ALL 50 states, the Fed law supercedes any local or state as they relate to modulators. Brake lite modulators are NOT legal anywhere.
Modulators do not mimmic emergency vehicles whose lites FLASH.
I've only ever had ONE vehicle move over in all the years because she thought I was an emergency vehicle.
Proof of increased safety? Can't count the times a cage was about to pull out without looking and all of the sudden they stab the brakes hard. Had folks turn around and chase me down to let me know my lite is blinking. I have NOT had a single cage pull out in front of me, not one, while running the modulator in some 15 years, thats proof enough for me.
There are some don'ts like not using it on interstate (trucks think you are flashing them over), or in a bike pack.
So use whatever EXCUSE you want for not making yourself visible, but don't complin when that cage crosses your path because they REALLY didn't see you.
Just my thoughts.......
Well said Teach....couldn't agree more...I will never understand those that choose to bash others and their ideas just because they don't agree with them. I always thought that was the idea behind having these types of forums so that we ALL could share ideas with each other without having to constantly defend them?? Oh well to each his own I guess. Ride safe....live long.
I can be the worlds worse in bashing, but I think disagreeing is not necessarily bashing. The experiences I've had with modulators, from a cage and a rider perspective is they are annoying and distracting to me. While I'm focused on the flashing light and trying to discern what it is I have taken my focus away from other threats or situations. Sure, I need to learn more how to focus, blah, blah, blah. But the real defense is a good offense. I've had less "encounters" since I've takin' my advise and be more attentive to the anticipation of ignorant people and I have found my riding much more enjoyable. Out of the 4,400 miles I've traversed so far I came across two modulators and they were on long stretches of highway. I wanted so bad to be like a bug to a light just to get them to turn the annoyance off. I forced myself to ignore it but as it is intended to do, it kept drawing me back. Fortunetely no deer or other creature were lurking in the woods ready to dart out, but then again I was perfectly safe becaue of the modulator. And by the way, out of the 4,400 miles in many different environments I have had ZERO close calls, though I did stare down an idiot that was taking to long to move back into his lane after passing, and yes I know he saw me and I think he was trying to "play chicken" with me.
Okay, again, my opinion, and my opinion only, and since there is an on/off switch, please use it sparingly.
Edited by varyder 2010-07-10 11:58 PM
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Tourer
Posts: 395
Moravia, IA | varyder - 2010-07-10 11:54 PM
I can be the worlds worse in bashing, but I think disagreeing is not necessarily bashing. The experiences I've had with modulators, from a cage and a rider perspective is they are annoying and distracting to me. While I'm focused on the flashing light and trying to discern what it is I have taken my focus away from other threats or situations. Sure, I need to learn more how to focus, blah, blah, blah. But the real defense is a good offense. I've had less "encounters" since I've takin' my advise and be more attentive to the anticipation of ignorant people and I have found my riding much more enjoyable. Out of the 4,400 miles I've traversed so far I came across two modulators and they were on long stretches of highway. I wanted so bad to be like a bug to a light just to get them to turn the annoyance off. I forced myself to ignore it but as it is intended to do, it kept drawing me back. Fortunetely no deer or other creature were lurking in the woods ready to dart out, but then again I was perfectly safe becaue of the modulator. And by the way, out of the 4,400 miles in many different environments I have had ZERO close calls, though I did stare down an idiot that was taking to long to move back into his lane after passing, and yes I know he saw me and I think he was trying to "play chicken" with me.
Okay, again, my opinion, and my opinion only, and since there is an on/off switch, please use it sparingly.
I wonder if its age, driving experience, how we were taught or what the difference is but I wonder why you are "drawn to" the modulator or have trouble with it while I have none. I see them all the time and dont have the same problems - perhaps its because Im around them more.
I see them quite often in my area...well actually alot of areas and states. I usually take 2 motorcycle trips a month that put me on the road for 500+ mile days (or longer if need be....but try to make them few and far between). So Ive been thru alot of states.....I see modulators everywhere....but then again in an environment where these guys are riders....not putting around town on a sunny day.
With 4400 miles you havent seen much......give it a few and add another zero there on the end. Ride out of your area.....out of your safety zone where you dont know the roads and what to expect the drivers to do.....you may (or may not) see the purpose.
I just got back from a ride thru Missouri, Oklahoma and Arkansas (then back to Iowa) Thursday, Friday and Saturday. I encountered modulators in every state. I also saw tons of Goldwings and Harleys.....but not a single Vision. I saw FAR more Goldwings then HDs.....but I really expected to see a few Visions. Ive only owned mine for 3 months and 17K miles so I guess Ive only been "looking" for them in that amount of time but they are fairly rare. | |
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Visionary
Posts: 8144
New Bohemia, VA | could be, I don't know. I've turned over 75,000 in a little more than 2 1/2 years on my Vision this morning and I'm on a return trip from VA to CA. Been through WV, IN, IL, MS, KS, CO, AZ and of course CA. I've visited family over the last couple days so I've only logged about 1,000 up to this point and have 2,000 in front me. The modulators I saw was through US 160 close to the Grand Canyon. For some reason, I've not seen a lot of bikes except around the parks, but I did see plenty today coming across RT50 in Nevada. None had modulators, but I guess out here there is not a need. I ride around VA all the time, everyday, and rarely do I see a modulator flashing. I'm in UT getting ready to I-70 back east. I really have no arguement, I'm stating my opinion, if it makes you feel safer, ride on!
Edited by varyder 2010-07-11 1:05 AM
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Iron Butt
Posts: 741
Central New York | Well I just installed one. After running it a few weeks I'll comment on my opinion. First I need to grow some new skin on my knuckles. I have to agree with those that commented in the headlight thread about laying the bike on the tip overs to access the headlight connectors/bulbs. Tried in on the side stand and up on a frame lift. Best I could do is tap one finger on the connector. Dropped it on the tip overs and I could easily grab the connector. Still lost some skin getting the connector off. Guess that's the price of admission. | |
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Tourer
Posts: 492
Indianapolis, IN | aaronrkelly - 2010-07-11 12:32 AM
varyder - 2010-07-10 11:54 PM
I can be the worlds worse in bashing, but I think disagreeing is not necessarily bashing. The experiences I've had with modulators, from a cage and a rider perspective is they are annoying and distracting to me. While I'm focused on the flashing light and trying to discern what it is I have taken my focus away from other threats or situations. Sure, I need to learn more how to focus, blah, blah, blah. But the real defense is a good offense. I've had less "encounters" since I've takin' my advise and be more attentive to the anticipation of ignorant people and I have found my riding much more enjoyable. Out of the 4,400 miles I've traversed so far I came across two modulators and they were on long stretches of highway. I wanted so bad to be like a bug to a light just to get them to turn the annoyance off. I forced myself to ignore it but as it is intended to do, it kept drawing me back. Fortunetely no deer or other creature were lurking in the woods ready to dart out, but then again I was perfectly safe becaue of the modulator. And by the way, out of the 4,400 miles in many different environments I have had ZERO close calls, though I did stare down an idiot that was taking to long to move back into his lane after passing, and yes I know he saw me and I think he was trying to "play chicken" with me.
Okay, again, my opinion, and my opinion only, and since there is an on/off switch, please use it sparingly.
I wonder if its age, driving experience, how we were taught or what the difference is but I wonder why you are "drawn to" the modulator or have trouble with it while I have none. I see them all the time and dont have the same problems - perhaps its because Im around them more.
I see them quite often in my area...well actually alot of areas and states. I usually take 2 motorcycle trips a month that put me on the road for 500+ mile days (or longer if need be....but try to make them few and far between). So Ive been thru alot of states.....I see modulators everywhere....but then again in an environment where these guys are riders....not putting around town on a sunny day.
With 4400 miles you havent seen much......give it a few and add another zero there on the end. Ride out of your area.....out of your safety zone where you dont know the roads and what to expect the drivers to do.....you may (or may not) see the purpose.
I just got back from a ride thru Missouri, Oklahoma and Arkansas (then back to Iowa) Thursday, Friday and Saturday. I encountered modulators in every state. I also saw tons of Goldwings and Harleys.....but not a single Vision. I saw FAR more Goldwings then HDs.....but I really expected to see a few Visions. Ive only owned mine for 3 months and 17K miles so I guess Ive only been "looking" for them in that amount of time but they are fairly rare.
Mr Kelly, not to remark any further regarding the pros and cons of headlight modulators up front, I will take a moment to defend VARIDER regarding your comment implying that he may need a few more miles before he offers his advise to this subject. If you will take the time to research this forum you will find that VA' is one of if not possibly the most experienced Vision rider on this forum. When he referred to 4400 miles he was referring to the amount of riding he has done on his current trip of less than two weeks. He's got a whole lot more riding experiences than you are giving him credit for.
I'm sure you as well have substantial riding miles under your belt, but make sure you understand who you are talking to or about before you make such comments, please. 
And regarding the your justification for modulators, please keep in mind that talking to motorcyclists about the merits is like preaching to the choir. Remember that 90% of the driving public that don't ride motorcycles have no idea why your light is blinking. For at least a percentage them that spells confusion when they encounter one. Even if its only a small percentage, I hate to think that somebody driving a car in my vicinity is confused because of me.
By the way I have had one on my other bike for about six years, I've experienced the occasional unusual reaction by other vehicles as I approached more than once. | |
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Tourer
Posts: 395
Moravia, IA | hoosiervic - 2010-07-14 3:44 PM
Mr Kelly, not to remark any further regarding the pros and cons of headlight modulators up front, I will take a moment to defend VARIDER regarding your comment implying that he may need a few more miles before he offers his advise to this subject. If you will take the time to research this forum you will find that VA' is one of if not possibly the most experienced Vision rider on this forum. When he referred to 4400 miles he was referring to the amount of riding he has done on his current trip of less than two weeks. He's got a whole lot more riding experiences than you are giving him credit for.
I'm sure you as well have substantial riding miles under your belt, but make sure you understand who you are talking to or about before you make such comments, please.
And regarding the your justification for modulators, please keep in mind that talking to motorcyclists about the merits is like preaching to the choir. Remember that 90% of the driving public that don't ride motorcycles have no idea why your light is blinking. For at least a percentage them that spells confusion when they encounter one. Even if its only a small percentage, I hate to think that somebody driving a car in my vicinity is confused because of me.
By the way I have had one on my other bike for about six years, I've experienced the occasional unusual reaction by other vehicles as I approached more than once.
He said 4400 miles.....I took it at face value. I dont make it a point to click and research everyones posting history before I make every single post. Waste of time. I dont discredit his riding experience.
Ive also experience an occasional unusual reaction, Im not going to say that doesnt happen. So far none of them have been harmful or threatening.....only the once or twice a year "pull off the road" or the head out window "hey your headlight is broken". My favorite was a State Trooper that pulled off the road for me....I got a kick out of that.
Ive never heard or experienced anyone fixate on the light and come across the line.......in fact I experience the opposite daily. Most will slow down and move away from the center line, giving me more room. | |
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Visionary
Posts: 8144
New Bohemia, VA | AK, no problem for me, I think my focus is not to stick gadgets all over my bike to be seen, but to try to ride in anticipation of what some idiot will do without thinking. Logic dictates too me that no matter what you will do to be notice, someone will not notice you. I have many case in points, like, why do police cars and other emergency vehicles get hit, clearly visible for a good distance with flashing lights and so on going on? Because people do not pay attention. Also, there are laws for automated billboards to display long enough so as not to distract the driver. Anytime there is a disturbance in the landscape the attention is natual to see what it is, taking attention away from the task at hand. That is how I feel about modulators, and there has never been one arguement compelling me enough to put one on my bike, yet I feel I would be more of annoyance than trying to be noticed so as not to get hit. The one significant close call that I have had , a modulator would never been a help as the car was approaching me perpendicular and did not see the red light, nor two lines of cars at that light when she speed through the free lane.
Modulators are not for wide open pasture, but areas of crossing traffic that might pull into your path, I think. When folks tell me that I might get killed on this thing, I remind them I could slip in the bathtub, or fall off the roof while cleaning the gutters, as people die that way every day too. The real sad part of all of this is that when I read about a motorcyclist getting killed it is usually because of their speed, riding under the influence, inexperienced, unfamiliar with the machine, unexpected conditions, or a road hazard. Very rarely, though it is the most publisized, do I read about a cager running over a bike because they were not seen, just as sad though. It demands of everyone who drives the public roads to PAY ATTENTION, and if I have to pay attention a little more to enjoy riding, so be it.
As I saw on a bill board in the west "BORN TO BE WILD...NOT CRAZY" Ride Aware! Says it all for me.
Edited by varyder 2010-07-14 5:36 PM
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Tourer
Posts: 395
Moravia, IA | varyder - 2010-07-14 5:24 PM
AK, no problem for me, I think my focus is not to stick gadgets all over my bike to be seen, but to try to ride in anticipation of what some idiot will do without thinking. Logic dictates too me that no matter what you will do to be notice, someone will not notice you. I have many case in points, like, why do police cars and other emergency vehicles get hit, clearly visible for a good distance with flashing lights and so on going on? Because people do not pay attention.
I agree with what your saying....this isnt a fix all. Its just another tool that alot of people use. Ive seen plenty of videos of cop cars getting creamed fully lit....it happens. Im just saying I think it reduces my odds......and Im all about reducing the odds. | |
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Visionary
Posts: 3006
San Antonio, TX | I ride with low beams and the HID on.
When I observe someone that might violate my lane, I turn on the high beams and leave them on until I pass them. Driveways and intersections are the most common places that I do this. Doing this has stopped many a cage from violating my lane.
Lately, I have had a few drivers that would make a left turn from my left to travel in the same direction that I am going. This area has a center turn lane. I can not tell if they have seen me so I get on the defensive. Before they pull out I turn on the highs, check to the rear to make sure I won't get run over if I stop, cover the brakes and/or slow down.
I had one accelerate in this center turn lane, illegally, going in my direction ahead of me at about 40 mph. Before I go to pass the law breaker, I tap my air horn. He tapped his horn so at least I know he knows I am there....so I pass him up with authority not sparing many of my horses of the Freedom engine.
To sum this up I manually modulate my high beams as needed. | |
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Tourer
Posts: 523
seattle, wa | radioteacher - 2010-07-15 8:50 AM
I ride with low beams and the HID on.
When I observe someone that might violate my lane, I turn on the high beams and leave them on until I pass them. Driveways and intersections are the most common places that I do this. Doing this has stopped many a cage from violating my lane.
Lately, I have had a few drivers that would make a left turn from my left to travel in the same direction that I am going. This area has a center turn lane. I can not tell if they have seen me so I get on the defensive. Before they pull out I turn on the highs, check to the rear to make sure I won't get run over if I stop, cover the brakes and/or slow down.
I had one accelerate in this center turn lane, illegally, going in my direction ahead of me at about 40 mph. Before I go to pass the law breaker, I tap my air horn. He tapped his horn so at least I know he knows I am there....so I pass him up with authority not sparing many of my horses of the Freedom engine.
To sum this up I manually modulate my high beams as needed.
+1 | |
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Tourer
Posts: 395
Moravia, IA | radioteacher - 2010-07-15 10:50 AM
I ride with low beams and the HID on.
When I observe someone that might violate my lane, I turn on the high beams and leave them on until I pass them. Driveways and intersections are the most common places that I do this. Doing this has stopped many a cage from violating my lane.
Lately, I have had a few drivers that would make a left turn from my left to travel in the same direction that I am going. This area has a center turn lane. I can not tell if they have seen me so I get on the defensive. Before they pull out I turn on the highs, check to the rear to make sure I won't get run over if I stop, cover the brakes and/or slow down.
I had one accelerate in this center turn lane, illegally, going in my direction ahead of me at about 40 mph. Before I go to pass the law breaker, I tap my air horn. He tapped his horn so at least I know he knows I am there....so I pass him up with authority not sparing many of my horses of the Freedom engine.
To sum this up I manually modulate my high beams as needed.
Good plan.
Problem is going to be that your observation may come to late one day. It has happened to alot of riders.
Ive never said, nor will I say, that a modulator is a substitute for riding defensively and using your crash avoidance skills. You dont slap this thing on and go rip up the pavement without concern simply cause its there.
Logic to me dictates that Im not infallible......Im not perfect. Now maybe you are but there are plenty of riders laying in graves that thought THEY could see dangers and avoid them......that they wouldnt hit a left turning car.....etc. To think that in every instance your going to be able to see danger and react quickly enough is presumptuous.
All Im doing is employing a tool to give me better odds.
Edited by aaronrkelly 2010-07-15 12:21 PM
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Iron Butt
Posts: 741
Central New York | I have completed the first day with the modulator, only about 60 miles of rural/city/highway commute. Can't say I saw an occasion where it saved my life, hope I never do. Also didn't see any adverse reactions (international salute, pulling off the road, etc.). One thing did vividly stand out though. Nobody violated my "safety space". That space you keep between you and the car ahead that everyone tries to squeeze into. I feel that the modulator makes you appear bigger, closer, and more intimidating. Whatever the reason, so far I like this gadget! | |
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Visionary
Posts: 8144
New Bohemia, VA | I guess as with Steve Irwin, (crocadile hunter) no matter how well you know your environment, or how comfortable you are in it, or how attentive you may be, or what precautions you may have taken, it only takes one prick to take you out. | |
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Cruiser
Posts: 184
Allen Park, MI | dbl post....dam puter.
Edited by Prostreet1 2010-07-15 1:19 PM
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Cruiser
Posts: 184
Allen Park, MI | varyder - 2010-07-15 2:07 PM
I guess as with Steve Irwin, (crocadile hunter) no matter how well you know your environment, or how comfortable you are in it, or how attentive you may be, or what precautions you may have taken, it only takes one prick to take you out.
+1 in a nutshell | |
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Visionary
Posts: 2118
Pitt Meadows, BC Canada | When Canada legislated Manditory Daylight Headlights on ALL motorvehicles some 30+ years ago, I had already been driving motorcycles WITHOUT the headlight on for about 20 years.
And I will tell you - I went from "at least one frightening event per week" to "almost NO frightening events per year". THAT'S how dramatic headlights on in daytime have been for me - and for Cagers. Simply put - this LAW drastically cut into the number of accidents occurring.
I have utmost confidence in being seen on the Vision with just low-beams and HID ON, and because modulators are very rare here - I agree that they are distracting, rather than helpful.
Spend your money on a fund to promote MANDITORY HEADLIGHTS rather than bruising your knuckles on installing scary lighting. Just my $ .02
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Tourer
Posts: 395
Moravia, IA | See I think the other way around.....with all the daytime running lights on cars you dont stand out anymore.....you blend in with everyone else. Everyone has there lights on.
In fact that was one reason they allowed modulators....to give the edge back to bikes that they gave them in the late 70s when they mandated headlight use. | |
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Visionary
Posts: 3006
San Antonio, TX | aaronrkelly - 2010-07-15 12:09 PM
Good plan.
Problem is going to be that your observation may come to late one day. It has happened to alot of riders.
Ive never said, nor will I say, that a modulator is a substitute for riding defensively and using your crash avoidance skills. You dont slap this thing on and go rip up the pavement without concern simply cause its there.
Logic to me dictates that Im not infallible......Im not perfect. Now maybe you are but there are plenty of riders laying in graves that thought THEY could see dangers and avoid them......that they wouldnt hit a left turning car.....etc. To think that in every instance your going to be able to see danger and react quickly enough is presumptuous.
All Im doing is employing a tool to give me better odds.
Man, what can I say. I know you are right. Sooner or later (I would prefer much much later like.....never) my number could come up.
I am sorry but I never discussed my thoughts on modulators just how I ride. I am neutral on them. Some days I want to buy one on other days I tell my self I do not need one. They could come in handy for Parade work but that is another topic.
I get an education every time I lift the kick stand.
On my daily commute I am lucky to know the road very well. It remember taking the road with my dad over three decades ago when I was fifteen years old with a learners permit. It is 7.5 miles each way consisting of a mix of four lane and two lane roads. For eight years I have taken the same path...for the last two years I ride it on the Vision.
The roads have no school zones but carry a lot of buses, students and school staff. I am convinced that the school staff at the districts main office drive much worse than the students, especially in the morning. They turn on the car and turn off the brain.
In that time I have seen many accidents and incidents. One spot makes me very nervous since I can still see stains on the pavement from the road flares to direct traffic where the rider was killed by a left turning cage.
I am not saying anything bad about modulators just describing the environment I ride in. Everyone should use the equipment that they feel will do the best job to get them safely to their destination.
Ride Safe | |
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Visionary
Posts: 3006
San Antonio, TX | Duplicate post.
Edited by radioteacher 2010-07-15 3:53 PM
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Iron Butt
Posts: 742
North Orange County CA | I have been reading these posts with great interest because for the last couple of months I have been noticing the increased number of motorcycle accident reports on the radio as I prep for my commute.
Every single workday for the last eight days (it may have been even longer, but that's how long I've been actually counting) I have heard words to the effect of "Motorcyclist down in the carpool lane on the XYZ freeway, traffic is backed up to _____." It has been my feeling since moving here 10 years ago that California gives drivers licenses to far too many nincompoops and this grizzly daily traffic report is just more evidence in support of my theory.
I can say with out equivocation that the increased visibility provided by the HID, my Clearwater driving lamps and the MOABL modification make me feel more secure; and on one occasion the Clearwaters kept me from being flattened like a pancake by a young lady who was merging onto the freeway and changing lanes while happily chatting away on her cellphone. A few months ago a riding friend of ours was run into the guardrail near the 91/15 freeway interchange by a woman doing exactly the same thing.
If I were commuting into LA, or any other major metropolitan area, I would install a modulator in a New York minute. You can bet, in light of the current trend in this area, that before I spend another nickel on cool stuff a modulator is going to get another much more serious look. | |
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Visionary
Posts: 1484
LaPorte,Tx. | Guys at work that have seen my Vision with the low beams, HID and the 55w PIAA lights on day or night comment it's like looking at one of the freight trains on the tracks. Again, they say it's like a freight train...how many people pull out in front of a freight train, very little, why because they see the light and don't pull out. Don't wana go there, freight train kill!!! They are really really smart people, the freight train will kill them. So if the lights on the front of my bike look like a freight train, then why do people pull out in front of me??? Because they are not scared of me, in a split second, they really realize that is NOT a freight train and they can pull out, because motorcycle is not going to KILL me. They see the light, it doesn't matter if it is modulating or not, they see it, they are just not scared of it.
After the accident and your on the ground this is the interview. Driver "Officer, I didn't see him" Officer says, "Didn't you see the motorcycle lights" Driver "no man, were there lights?"
My fellow riders, it doesn't matter what headlight you got, they are not scared of you. Ride like your not even there. See you on down the road. | |
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Visionary
Posts: 8144
New Bohemia, VA | VisionTex - 2010-07-15 6:49 PM
My fellow riders, it doesn't matter what headlight you got, they are not scared of you. Ride like your not even there. See you on down the road.
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Visionary
Posts: 3006
San Antonio, TX | varyder - 2010-07-15 5:53 PM
VisionTex - 2010-07-15 6:49 PM
My fellow riders, it doesn't matter what headlight you got, they are not scared of you. Ride like your not even there. See you on down the road.
+1
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Iron Butt
Posts: 741
Central New York | Well it's been a month of 60 mile days. A bit over 1800 miles of commuting from bumper to bumper city to 75MPH highway. But mostly 55MPH rural roads. The only negative effect has been a couple older guys signaling to me that my light was flashing. No cars have pulled over, nobody has gotten angry, nobody has indicated annoyance, no police have even shown signs of interest, and no other bikers have called me a sissy.
The positives are that no one has pulled out in front of me, no one has taken my safety zone, and no one has changed lanes into me. I would never say this thing is a cure all, but I do believe it makes a biker visually equal to a cager. 
My conclusion after running a headlight modulator for a month: Anyone who would not invest the $90. into a safety item like this, is really wasting their money on a helmet. (No offense)
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Cruiser
Posts: 156
Bluff Park, Alabama - God's Country! 2011 PW VV | OK good info!
Now - for those who have one on their VV, please let us know what make and model you have.
According to Kisan, the P115W-H7 is the model for the Vision. Is this correct?
Thanks,
CHUCK | |
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Tourer
Posts: 395
Moravia, IA | ghostssx - 2010-10-23 12:44 AM
OK good info!
Now - for those who have one on their VV, please let us know what make and model you have.
According to Kisan, the P115W-H7 is the model for the Vision. Is this correct?
Thanks,
CHUCK
P115W-H7
DETAILS BMW, Yamaha, Suzuki & European bikes with single H7 (2-pin Euro) Bulb H7(Euro)
NO....that is not correct. Their information is wrong. You have H4 bulbs, not H7s. You also have dual bulbs, not singles.....although you can use a single bulb modulator if you just want 1 bulb to modulate.
I recommend a dual bulb H4 modulator.
I use Comagination products.
Here is a link to their modulators:
http://www.comagination.com/modBulb.htm
The D100H4 is what Im using.....$79.95
Ive got these on 6 or 7 bikes....been using them for years (along with their tail light modulators).....never had a single issue. They work just as good and are cheaper then the Kisan units. Due to federal standards they all MUST perform the same.....so why pay more.
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Cruiser
Posts: 156
Bluff Park, Alabama - God's Country! 2011 PW VV | Thanks for info, ak. Easy to install? | |
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Tourer
Posts: 395
Moravia, IA | ghostssx - 2010-10-24 12:18 AM
Thanks for info, ak. Easy to install?
I didnt have any problem.....Ive got huge hands and it took maybe 30 mins....plug and play.
Others report 2+ hours of cussing and ranting because its tight in there....so Im not quite sure what to tell you.
I DO recommend laying it over on the tip overs to make it easier to get your hands in there. | |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 741
Central New York | I use the Coagination. Happy with the product. | |
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Cruiser
Posts: 156
Bluff Park, Alabama - God's Country! 2011 PW VV | Thanks for info guys. It's on the upgrade list!! | |
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Visionary
Posts: 1365
Central Maryland | I'm going to have to send the Kisan modulator back. I can't get the rubber boots for the halogen bulbs to seal up right around the "plug -n- play" Kisan modulator assemblies themselves - too tight; as well as there's a interconnecting wire between the two master and slave units (on the side of each unit) that the rubber boot is ill fitting for.
I went ahead and ordered the Coagination dual modulator; looks to be an easier install with the modulator itself not self contained to the plug that affixes directly on to the H4 prongs themselves.
I really feel naked riding my Vision without a modulator(s). Have had modulators on every bike that I've owned (present and previously). I highly recommend them. | |
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Tourer
Posts: 307
Columbia, SC | I've got comagination. 4 years, 3 bikes, all weather riding and still going strong. A couple zipties and you can put it on any bike and hide it well.
Alexi | |
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Let's Talk Headlamp Modulators