|
|
Visionary
Posts: 1359
New Bohemia, Va | Food for the thought: A topic came up about the Victory Motorcycle Club dues over at the club's forums. (thevmc.com) It came to the attention that a lot of guests were getting the same information as paying members are getting for free. That spawned me to ask what am I getting for my $$. I think they get that settled now, and that is not what I want to discuss. Harley has made their brand a family thing, and all Victory is really saying is "we're better than Harley". In my mind that just doesn't fly as it is just an agrument of which is truly better. My understanding the Harley Owner's Group is the voice of the people in cahoots with the manufacturer, smart move on Harley's part. H.O.G. helps promote the brand, organizes charitable and community events for the brand owners. The VMC has sort of done that, but it can't do that if I get very little for my $$ except to be one of the fools to help pay for things that others don't have to pay.
The good thing is that theVMC is established and has been around just as long as the brand has. It is a club, not as in a Motorcycle patch wearing Club, but a "I own a Victory" and I want to share with others club. We have all come to realize that Victory and the owners are really not in tight with one another as the HOGS and Harley are, but I think it is about time that we move to that level.
I've been a member of theVMC for the past three years, almost as long as I own a Victory. As a club member we have things we can say to steer the course of the club. I say it is high time to say, if you own a Victory, why are you not a club member? Currently KevinX is our club president, if you like him, join. If you like to be like him, join. If you don't like him, join so you can vote him out. (an attempt at humor) but the bottom line is to join. Then work together to further the brand, form chapters, organize rides for charities and community, you do it anyway, and most chapters do, but if you're not a member it's hard to promote.
Yeah, I'm on a soap box, but only because nobody encouraged me to join, I just did because I thought they were doing something for me. Well, I found out they do, just not as much as I thought. However, I renew my dues every year because it pays off, but won't pay if I can get the same info for free. We need you to join and help make theVMC better for all of us.
No, I'm not running for anything and don't care to, but I'll support you if you do.
go join http://thevmc.com the best $15 you'll spend this year.
Edited by Cap'n Nemo 2011-03-22 4:15 PM
| |
| | |
Iron Butt
Posts: 849
, FL United States | + 1 | |
| | |
Tourer
Posts: 520
Simi Valley, CA | I would like to see the VMC and the VRA merge someday, have mother V take on some of the responsibility and financing... Something similar to the HOG setup, you buy a bike you get a free year membership.... | |
| | |
Visionary
Posts: 1359
New Bohemia, Va | that's a grand idea cometman, and there is no reason why they couldn't. I voiced that the VMC needs substance to keep the membership. The GWRRA and the HOG folks do that. They make you think you have to be a member if you own their brand. If I'm not mistaken GWRRA has a brochure that goes with the sale, and HOG, they usually have folks who work at the dealer who are members. I worked with a guy that was a HOG member and he was constantly talking about one charity ride or event after another, and he aways said I was welcome to come regardless what I road, I'd just have to pay a little more for eats. I never went to one, but hey, that's how they could have got me into the "family". | |
| | |
Visionary
Posts: 4278
| Harley gives you a member ship in HOG when you buy a bike. Its a national member ship and each dealer has its own HOG club that you pay to belong to. The more you spend at a dealer you can get discounts. For a thousand dollars you get 10% off and for 2000 dollars you get 20% off. But its only good for one year.
Harley all so give you a monthly magazine and a USA Atlas that shows all there dealer with address and phone number. At all events like dayton and sturgis they have a HOG store and have finger food.
In my opinion harley treats there owners and HOG members way better then victory.
I love my Vision and am a member of VMC and will only get ride of my Vision for a newer one. 
Edited by john frey 2011-03-22 5:20 PM
| |
| | |
Cruiser
Posts: 160
Lennox, SD | I have been a VMC member since buying my Vision, I intend to remain a member.
We don't have an active chapter in my area and the dealer doesn't seem to interested in supporting the VMC.
I wish that the area chapter was more active but I have a chapter 70 miles away I can always join.
I will remain a member of VMC as long as I own my Vision or any Victory. I will try to attend some of their gatherings during the year if I can. | |
| | |
Visionary
Posts: 1632
Jasper, MO | Cometman - 2011-03-22 4:20 PM
I would like to see the VMC and the VRA merge someday, have mother V take on some of the responsibility and financing... Something similar to the HOG setup, you buy a bike you get a free year membership....
I'm a member of both. The VMC has grown much more than the VRA, as far as I can see. Victory corporate tried to ignore the VMC in its infancy, and promote the VRA instead. There is no doubt that Victory corporate now recognizes the VMC as a force to be recognized. The last issue of the Victory Rider magazine lists five key dates to remember in 2011 on page 5. Three of them are, or were, VMC events first. The Victory Highway Relay and the VMC National Meet are still VMC events, and the American Victory Rally was started by the VMC and was originally known as the Victory Homecoming. The first event by that name was held at the Spirit Lake factory on July 4, 1999. The factory took over the event and co-opted the name in 2002, and then changed the name to the current American Victory Rally. "Officially" the event "started" in 2002.
I can imagine that the VMC might someday become to Victory what the GWRRA is to Honda, which is a club based on the brand, which has close ties to the company, but remains a private entity composed of individual members. The brand is young yet, as is the VMC. They'll learn to grow together.
The GWRRA is a paid membership only club. They give members tangible benefits with a paid membership, such as dealer lists, dealer discounts, maps, roadside assistance, etc. They sponsor national meets every year, like the famous Wing Ding. They get a lot of cooperation from Honda. If you are not a paid member of the Club, you can not even access the forums, let alone participate. In case you're wondering how they can get members this way, consider that they have 800 chapters in 53 countries and over 80,000 paid members. No freeloaders.
I don't know if the VMC has grown to the point where it needs to become exclusive to paid members only yet. When that day comes, there will need to be more tangible benefits that accompany membership, and that is where an alliance between Victory and the VMC will become important. A spirit of cooperation between the two entities needs to develop, and I think it will as time goes on.
Victory has already made overtures to the VMC and has paid members who are trying to reach out to us owners. Those very few of our membership who are professional pissers and moaners and always publicly wanting to know "can I sue?" are not helping themselves or the cause. On the other side of that coin, Victory needs to learn to step up and provide a better means of dealing with owners' legitimate concerns. As I said before, both entities are young, growing, and learning. I see hope in the future. I've already seen a lot of progress in the past 11 years of Victory ownership. I think it'll get even better as time goes on. If you're not already a member of the VMC, I suggest you join and make positive contributions when you can. We will all benefit.
Ronnie
| |
| | |
Tourer
Posts: 494
Akron Ohio area | Cap'n Nemo states;
"I say it is high time to say, if you own a Victory, why are you not a club member"?
I decided on a Victory because I wanted to avoid the cult like following of Harley.
| |
| | |
Tourer
Posts: 520
Simi Valley, CA | FYI- been a member of VMC since before I owed my Vision...
| |
| | |
Visionary
Posts: 1359
New Bohemia, Va | bigfoot - 2011-03-22 6:51 PM
Cap'n Nemo states;
"I say it is high time to say, if you own a Victory, why are you not a club member"?
I decided on a Victory because I wanted to avoid the cult like following of Harley.
that's fine bigfoot I don't expect everyone to join, but what I'm calling for is a coming together with the brand. As far as the cult like following, I'm perhaps the biggest lone wolf around, but there is strength in numbers to help get more dealers and better support. Like it was mentioned, the more positive influence within the club, the better we will all be. There is no need to start something new, just make what we have stronger. I believe our current VMC president would support strengthening the club and increasing the membership. Even if you never join, I hope we'll ride together and grab a cup of joe someday. Ride hard, ride long, ride safe... | |
| | |
Visionary
Posts: 1229
Rancho Cucamonga, CA | My Dealer dropped the ball. When I bought my Vision, I got no information about ANY Victory clubs. Still trying to figure out how to get my free magazines. I do like the organization that HD has with the HOG clubs. Matter of fact, I still go to a lot of their events. The local HOG club doesn't require you ride a HD, only that you are a HOG national member, which I got a lifetime membership to before selling my HD for a much better bike. Who knows, the more I go to their events, maybe the more will come over.
And yes, I am a VMC member, but find the conversations here more friendly.
Edited by Nozzledog 2011-03-22 7:53 PM
| |
| | |
Cruiser
Posts: 100
| I have been an active member of the VMC since 07 when I bought my 1st Victory, I found the VMC fishing online for parts and tech help. Since then I have made alot of good friends (LIKE COMETMAN) online as well as at local VMC events. I also with some help from some great people have organized a local chapter here where I live in Kern county. We have 38 member's to date. We welcome everyone on our rides....all makes and models. We promote Victory, we promote our local dealer,we also have monthly rides, meetings and raise money for charities . I HAVE NEVER MET A BETTER GROUP OF PEOPLE! I enjoy both venue's, I think they could co-exist easily. Blister | |
| | |
Cruiser
Posts: 162
Extreme Southern, AZ United States | Was a member, couldn't stay tho. Buncha no lifes on the board. I don't need to be in an internet club. I am in a real club. Don't even visit to look any more. | |
| | |
Visionary
Posts: 1359
New Bohemia, Va | justbob, it is what it is, but it is not an internet club, and it is not a M/C motorcycle 3-patch wearing club either. It is a club of Victory Motorcycle enthusiasts. Okay, now what? Well, I thought theVMC is an extention of the VRA sorta of, unsanctioned, but it was the place the people went. The VRA is corporate so all they want is my $$$$, just as they did when they sold me my motorcycle. But the club is the people, it has chapters, it has representation, it gives you cool things because you are member. I can agree with you on some of the characters on the board, but here's what I found out, it has little focus beyond the few meets and the occassional fund-raiser. All good stuff, but theVMC can be much better. When I bought my Victory the dealer had the big winged-V-Twin banner of theVMC in the showroom and I thought cool. I asked, what's that? Their answer, "A bunch of cry-babies that think they know something about motorcycles" Whoa, I thought, I guess there is some bad-blood. There sure was, I went to the site, like some of the things I saw and joined. Trust me, I was glad I joined as their was a wealth of knowledge to be gleaned, but there is a lot of bad blood. Why? Because the members let it get that way. And this past year I found out that there are folks getting all of this for free while I was being a faithful due payer. Okay, so with all the bad why I'm stirring the pot? Because the membership can make it better. I don't even have a chapter, I tried to get the old officers of the used to be chapter going, but you know what I found out, there is still bad blood. The dealer is closed, there is no common ground to bring folks back together but.... folks who ride victory motorcycles still get together. Okay, sounds like a good time to start a club. But we have one already, it just needs to be readjusted a little.
There's nothing too terrible broke about theVMC that cannot be fixed once there is a focus and direction. You're right, for the casual observer it is an internet club. But I look last at the internet as being the substance of the club, the club is getting with fellow vicsters to plan a charitable ride, or hang out for a little bit and talk motorcycles. Or lend a helping hand, or stop by and say hey. Okay, can you do all of that without a club? Sure. But it's hard to promote the brand that in the end will help all of us by having one voice, and sticking together. A chapter that will promote the dealer and the dealer that will help the riders with the corporate.
Okay, so they tried all of that, my point is, why quit trying? If this doesn't go anywhere, it probably won't affect me much, I'll ride my Vision until the wheels fall off and stop paying my dues because I don't want nothing for something. We'll still be the brand that is better than Harley, but we just don't care but to brag about that we are better. And by the comments some folk makes, especially the ones that complain the loudest, is the reason why the brand is where it is.
But those who have a positive outlook and want to help further the brand for more dealers, support, fellowship, helping others, and so on, come on and join and make it what it ought to be, if it does go somewhere, we'll all be the better for it.
Okay, I'll shut up.
Edited by Cap'n Nemo 2011-03-23 5:30 AM
| |
| | |
Visionary
Posts: 1350
| Have you done a search of the archives for info and posts before you became a member? Everything you have posted has been brought up before at TheVMC. That big VMC banner costs $350 to make. O.O I had one in my closet for several years before someone finally asked for it. The note inside said to hang it in my garage? That was the stick that broke the camels back. I felt the manners should be used to promote the club not the officers.
I made business cards for TheVMC and placed them in several shops plus kept them stocked and some of us would leave them on Victory bikes if we could not find the owner. TheVMC said we had to stop doing that because they didn't have control and then no one was putting the cards out.
Pete rode his '99 to IA way back in '99 before there was a VMC so they didn't start the get together. We would ride out to Wings and Wheels in WI meeting up with others along the way till the accident put an end to that. I was there when Victory Corp first mentioned the VMC. I was there when we gave the plant the VMC handlebar clamp.
Spike is a great guy but only posted about 6 times a year while president yet people kept voting him president? I feel a president needs to be more involved.
Does HD "own" HOG and Honda "own" GWWRA? Is this so the lawyers have better control? At my local HD shop the local HOG chapter handles the test rides at open houses. This promotes HOG. Should I say if the VMC did that all the buyers would hear were complaints against Victory?
I have no problem with promoting the VMC but please do your homework before. The VMC has had the potential be be great for Victory but they have fallen too many times.
This is like many VMC posts, so many think the VMC could be so much better but don't want to be the ones in office to make it happen. Get someone else to do it. Yes, it sucks signed into a VMC officer meeting and spending an hour with people greeting late comers and discussing everything but what needs to be done while they are on west coast time.
So I guess what I am saying is step up and do something instead of yapping about. DON"T PASS THE BUCK, it's already been done. | |
| | |
Visionary
Posts: 1359
New Bohemia, Va | Okay Redrider, you are correct is some regards by not doing the homework, but you know what I find out when I do? We get bogged down in the past and the trap of we tried that before and end up doing nothing. We all whine about something, and then do nothing. One problem I have is that the ones that says we tried that before so what's the use, is the ones keeping theVMC right where it is, on the decline. You have new leadership, KevinX, and no he's not ask me to do anything, we don't even get along. But you know what? I'll support him as president and try and be a voice to how I feel the membership should go in agreement with many others that feel the same way. After three years this is the same old story, I want to see a new story. It's not about the old good ole boys of theVMC it is about the owners of Victory motorcycles that wants to make a difference.
Maybe Victory will continue to be the brand that really never got anywhere because all we did was whine and moan while riding the best bikes in the world. Harley got it figured out as does GWRRA - have a coalition, have a purpose, have one voice, no wonder the brand continues to stay dispite the discomfort and problems, the people who ride them stick together.
I apologize to Jeff and Miles and ask that you either strike or freeze this thread to prevent further discussions. | |
| | |
Iron Butt
Posts: 669
Peachtree City, GA | "So I guess what I am saying is step up and do something instead of yapping about. DON"T PASS THE BUCK, it's already been done."
+1
I have been around theVMC since 2003 and I can agree with what some of you have said. However, there are some parts that I feel are listed incorrectly. 1st off, Guest do not have full access. Nor would we want them to. Yes the membership boards need to be updated. Anyone want to contribute?
Yes there is some bad blood and in some cases for good reason. In other word - pay attention to the clubs by-laws and chapter's members wants...
As for bad blood with dealers - it happens there are good ones and bad ones - I personally would not trust my life to a few of them (working on my bike). I have no issue with someone voicing their opinion of a dealer - as long as they want to explain their situation or problem with the dealer. But that is my choice if I would use them.
I have met more follow Vic riders and gain more knowledge through theVMC then another club or internet group out there.
And by the way - there are several corporate folks on the theVMC paying attention...
If you don't like the way theVMC is ran - join up run for office and make the changes.
| |
| | |
Visionary
Posts: 1359
New Bohemia, Va | I'm not passing any buck, just encouraging more positive members to join with the right focus that have fresh ideas, ones that will get past the days of old.
The membership is on the decline and there is really little true direction. I have spawned some ideas to get some more substance in theVMC, not the forums.
But it takes the membership, not just one person to carry the load. You don't necessarily have to run for office to make changes, just support the ones that are in office and encourage them to move in the right direction for the membership. | |
| | |
Fountain Inn, SC United States | I'm curious so please indulge me. What do you think is missing from Vision-Riders (and it's sister sites) that you all think we should have?
Is it a sense of community?
Member discounts?
Sponsored Events?
More content? If so, like what?
| |
| | |
Visionary
Posts: 1359
New Bohemia, Va | Excellent question Jeff. I don't know if anything is missing - it is an excellent forum that provides a great sense of community, and it has some offering of discounts from vendor sponsors. I don't think we've had any sponsored events, and I'm not sure if I could attend unless I can fit my schedule around it.
As far as content, that would be people driven, unless you want to divide up in other sub-division like victory basket weavers or something. Personally, I never knew what drove me on this site to post via my alter-ego, and even under this handle I can't help but post and post often. Other forums do not have a draw like this one does for me. Somewhere in the back of my mind that if I can help keep the site active, others will continue to chime in on other topics, interesting this is an observation that I make for myself.
I think the way that you can make it better is take to a higher level with membership that will give it infrastructure and funds to support events and promotions while giving something tangible in exchange for dues. As an internet forum though, you guys are spot on... | |
| | |
Cruiser
Posts: 273
Midlothian, Va. | Jedi Jeff - 2011-03-23 10:03 AM I'm curious so please indulge me. What do you think is missing from Vision-Riders (and it's sister sites) that you all think we should have? Is it a sense of community? Member discounts? Sponsored Events? More content? If so, like what? I would like to have the ability to be able to delete our own post. Small example would be the classifieds where you sold something then you could delete the ad instead of just having it hanging out there and being able to delete a double post.
| |
| | |
Visionary
Posts: 1229
Rancho Cucamonga, CA | I have sold 3 things in the classified's, and was able to delete the post after each one sold. | |
| | |
Cruiser
Posts: 273
Midlothian, Va. | When I started looking at Victory in the fall of '09 I joined the VMC as a guest and when I purchased my Vision which is one year old today I had already joined VR about a month or so sooner. My initial interest was the CC until I got the killer deal on the Vision and when I did I then paid the $15. Well 322 post over there and 157 here I'm happy in both worlds. I'm still a admin on the Va VTX riders forum and still ride with them. I changed brands not friends and I'm also a 8 year member of the VTXOA where I have a lot of friends also. I'm a firm believer in riding, not brands. | |
| | |
Cruiser
Posts: 273
Midlothian, Va. | Nozzledog - 2011-03-23 11:12 AM I have sold 3 things in the classified's, and was able to delete the post after each one sold.You are correct, sorry. I just went back to an ad I had and was able to delete it. Is there a way to delete a double post?
| |
| | |
Iron Butt
Posts: 669
Peachtree City, GA | Biscuit - 2011-03-23 11:15 AM
When I started looking at Victory in the fall of '09 I joined the VMC as a guest and when I purchased my Vision which is one year old today I had already joined VR about a month or so sooner. My initial interest was the CC until I got the killer deal on the Vision and when I did I then paid the $15. Well 322 post over there and 157 here I'm happy in both worlds. I'm still a admin on the Va VTX riders forum and still ride with them. I changed brands not friends and I'm also a 8 year member of the VTXOA where I have a lot of friends also. I'm a firm believer in riding, not brands.
Well put!
From a fellow x - VTX rider
| |
| | |
Iron Butt
Posts: 669
Peachtree City, GA | Jedi Jeff - 2011-03-23 10:03 AM
I'm curious so please indulge me. What do you think is missing from Vision-Riders (and it's sister sites) that you all think we should have?
Is it a sense of community?
Member discounts?
Sponsored Events?
More content? If so, like what?
One feature I would like to see is when I hit the new threads button... (it does a great job of showing me the new threads) - BUT - I would also like to see the new items that are listed in the Classified sections as well....
Just saying it would be a nice feature for those of us that forget that it is there and miss out on some deals...
I have always viewed the Vision-Riders forum as a more "no nonsense technical forum" then TheVMC and in my opinion TheVOG is a joke...
BUT that is not to say I don't get something from each one of them. I do otherwise I would not look at each... | |
| | |
Visionary
Posts: 1359
New Bohemia, Va | If we are doing the compare, do not go the VOG way, I just don't get it, though it appears a few ldo ike it. It seems to be a marketing tool more than anything else.
The VRnetwork site is good too, but it just doesn't seem to be very active. It might be because folks are too much on facebook or something.
I do agree on the new thread functionality features for the classifieds, I don't think about it because I always come in looking at the "new threads" and that doesn't show. I think from the home page though it shows the newest threads for most areas. | |
| | |
Visionary
Posts: 4278
| Why change whats not broken? You come here to read and see whats going on. Right? So you can't take a extra few minuets to movies the mouse around or is to much exercise for you. | |
| | |
Puddle Jumper
Posts: 19
| Cap'n Nemo - 2011-03-23 4:16 PM
If we are doing the compare, do not go the VOG way, I just don't get it, though it appears a few ldo ike it. It seems to be a marketing tool more than anything else.
The VRnetwork site is good too, but it just doesn't seem to be very active. It might be because folks are too much on facebook or something.
I do agree on the new thread functionality features for the classifieds, I don't think about it because I always come in looking at the "new threads" and that doesn't show. I think from the home page though it shows the newest threads for most areas.
Okay I have been following this thread and staying out of it but I have to ask as a long time member of the VOG what are they marketing? They don't sell memberships, charge dues, make any money off of the classified section, put together a heck of a free lunch for us at bike week and gives us some really good videos on the products we love. So what are they marketing. Just curious. | |
| | |
Puddle Jumper
Posts: 19
| I have seen sites that mix their classified section with new post. You don't want to go there, the new thread just fill up with people selling crap. | |
| | |
Visionary
Posts: 1359
New Bohemia, Va | dsjr70 - 2011-03-24 8:35 AM
Cap'n Nemo - 2011-03-23 4:16 PM
If we are doing the compare, do not go the VOG way, I just don't get it, though it appears a few ldo ike it. It seems to be a marketing tool more than anything else.
The VRnetwork site is good too, but it just doesn't seem to be very active. It might be because folks are too much on facebook or something.
I do agree on the new thread functionality features for the classifieds, I don't think about it because I always come in looking at the "new threads" and that doesn't show. I think from the home page though it shows the newest threads for most areas.
Okay I have been following this thread and staying out of it but I have to ask as a long time member of the VOG what are they marketing? They don't sell memberships, charge dues, make any money off of the classified section, put together a heck of a free lunch for us at bike week and gives us some really good videos on the products we love. So what are they marketing. Just curious.
just my take when I visited a long time ago, I don't hang out there, but I'm entitled to an opinion, JMHO!
Edited by Cap'n Nemo 2011-03-24 9:51 AM
| |
| | |
Puddle Jumper
Posts: 19
| Cap'n Nemo - 2011-03-24 10:50 AM
dsjr70 - 2011-03-24 8:35 AM
Cap'n Nemo - 2011-03-23 4:16 PM
If we are doing the compare, do not go the VOG way, I just don't get it, though it appears a few ldo ike it. It seems to be a marketing tool more than anything else.
The VRnetwork site is good too, but it just doesn't seem to be very active. It might be because folks are too much on facebook or something.
I do agree on the new thread functionality features for the classifieds, I don't think about it because I always come in looking at the "new threads" and that doesn't show. I think from the home page though it shows the newest threads for most areas.
Okay I have been following this thread and staying out of it but I have to ask as a long time member of the VOG what are they marketing? They don't sell memberships, charge dues, make any money off of the classified section, put together a heck of a free lunch for us at bike week and gives us some really good videos on the products we love. So what are they marketing. Just curious.
just my take when I visited a long time ago, I don't hang out there, but I'm entitled to an opinion, JMHO!
Yes you are but usually when someone gives an opinion they follow it up with some reasons. | |
| | |
Iron Butt
Posts: 965
New York State | Hey do not knock "theVog.net. I belong to both sites wwwvmc.com but I have to send a check to the VMC the VOG is free. Now someone will say you get what you pay for.
Well I got a free lunch from the VOG.
The VMC is a good reasource as is this board but I belonged to this board and the VOG first because they were free. I later met some VMC members and paid.
This board is fine for telling tales of Victory motorcycle rides or looking up a repair but there it ends
The VOG is open to anyone who rides or is thinking about riding a motorcycle or trike of any brand much like ABATE plus it has a off topic side many find enjoyable.
The VMC is trying to be important in the Victory world, much as HOG is in HD land I do not oppose the desire and wish them well.
I personaly rode Triumph's because the 'Shoulds" that come with HD make me laugh,ie You should wear black HD shirts everyday, you should only hang with other HDers .
I ride two wheels and if I see another vehicle in trouble I assist if I can no matter the amount of wheels or brand.
Victory's are strong solid machines and as long as that is the case then Triumph's and Victory's will be my rides if either company cheeps out and the product slips I will shop Yamaha or Honda if they offer what I desire in a road machine.
HD and I will never be joined just to much baggage
Edited by Trekwolf164 2011-03-24 10:53 AM
| |
| | |
Visionary
Posts: 1359
New Bohemia, Va | I don't think I was knocking it terms of form and function of this site comparing it to that site. Both meets people's needs in different ways. Some find the VOG very appealing as evident by the rebuttals of a small simple comment, but I don't think Vision-Riders will appeal to me if it went that way. I'm not into having 40 differents sites all trying to do the same thing either, nor do I have time to go to multiple of sites to see what is going on. Now, to keep us on track and target of the original post, this is about promoting the brand and helping everyone to suceed, but for some reason us Victory riders are bound to argue instead of coming together for the greater cause. We use the forums to complain and moan about problems and publicly say the bike sucks, then in the same breath say its the best bike in the world.
The VMC, that is, the Victory Motorcyle Club is not a website, it is the people that owns Victory motorcycles, the website is ancillary and a venue to promote and communicate. We all have the capability at our finger tips to create as many websites as we want about anything we want. But the best way to promote the brand like HOG has and GWRRA, we have to take and do something as good or better if we are to get in the game like them. Nobody cares about Indian at all but those that do have a very good banding together as well. But Victory, well, I just haven't figured it out after 3 1/2 years of lonership. Us who ride Victory as a whole is the perfect example of you can't please all the people all the time, and it is nearly impossible to please even some. I see that I'm failing at my mission and I guess it might be best to pack my bags and go away. If you see me on the road, wave, I'll be the one on the Midnight Cherry Classic Vision with the big smile on my face.. If you all want to join my club, come on.
Edited by Cap'n Nemo 2011-03-24 10:52 AM
| |
| | |
Puddle Jumper
Posts: 19
| Trekwolf164 - 2011-03-24 11:30 AM
Well I got a free lunch from the VOG.
Don't forget the free patches, pins and seat warmers... Although the seat warmers win hands down!
(VOG Meetup 2.jpg)
Attachments
----------------
 VOG Meetup 2.jpg (32KB - 0 downloads)
| |
| | |
Iron Butt
Posts: 965
New York State | dsjr70 - 2011-03-24 10:52 AM
Trekwolf164 - 2011-03-24 11:30 AM
Well I got a free lunch from the VOG.
Don't forget the free patches, pins and seat warmers... Although the seat warmers win hands down!
Shhh if everyone finds out about the pin and patches being free the lines for food will get to long at the next meet up. | |
| | |
Puddle Jumper
Posts: 19
| Cap'n Nemo - 2011-03-24 11:50 AM
The VMC, that is, the Victory Motorcyle Club is not a website, it is the people that owns Victory motorcycles, the website is ancillary and a venue to promote and communicate.
Okay, I will bite.... First I will say coming on to a website to promote another is just wrong. With that said, the VMC is a website AND a club. You have to pay seperate dues for each so they are seperate entities.
I bought a Victory because I wanted an American made bike. I looked at HD and then found Victory. I am on #5 and in two weeks will be purchasing a CC. Most Vic riders I know are just guys that like to ride. If they wanted to be part of a club they would have bought an HD and joined HOG. If you look at the mileage on our bikes they are usually substantially higher then the average cruiser rider. I ride with my friends, they have Harley's, Suzuki's, Kawasaki's ect... I also own a Honda, that is another thing that seperates a Vic owner, they usually are not brand snobs, they test road a bike and bought the one that best suited them.
So when I started looking at Vics I went to several websites. I found several, did my homework and went and bought a couple of Vegas's (one for me and the ex). Shortly afterwards I did pipes and a processor, I had and issue with the install and posted on the VOG and the VMC. I was pissed at my dealer (now out of business) because of the lack of support he gave me after the bike had been in there 5 times. I kept monitoring the post and the VOG members helped me out. The two comments I got from the VMC were 1. that I should become a paying member and 2. to find another dealer. It ended up one of the VOG members gave me contact information for a guy at Ness and after talking with him they found I had a bad Big Shot processor.
My second experience was when I was looking at the Vision again I went to several sites to get information. Most sites were very informative but the guys over on the VMC were flaming the bike to peices saying it shouldnt be call a Victory.
The site just seemed to fanboy'ish for me. I prefer this site over it but I dont own a Vision anymore so there is not much for me to post. The VOG is my preference because it is all over the place and when I posted my review of my Fury it was welcomed with open arms and when I say something negative about I bike I dont get completely flamed. Yes our bikes are great but they are not perfect.
To conclude, I am not here to pit one site against another. They all have their good and bad points. What you prefer I may not but I do not like anyone coming onto someone elses website and promoting an agenda. If membership is falling over at the VMC there is a reason why, spend time on there and fix it. I could tell you ways to do that but not on here, it would have to be over there.
Don | |
| | |
Fountain Inn, SC United States | Cap'n Nemo - 2011-03-24 11:50 AM
I see that I'm failing at my mission and I guess it might be best to pack my bags and go away. If you see me on the road, wave, I'll be the one on the Midnight Cherry Classic Vision with the big smile on my face.. If you all want to join my club, come on.
Chris - by all means, don't go away. Your insight is just as valuable as everyone else's here. I hope you (and everyone for that matter) are just as evangelical about Vision-Riders on the VMC and VOG forums.
That was why I asked that, aside from the club aspect, what is Vision-Riders lacking?
| |
| | |
Visionary
Posts: 1359
New Bohemia, Va | Okay, I will bite, I like that. Again, folks continue the issue that has plagued Victory owners and the associated club all along, bickering. I'm not here to bicker, or pit one site against another, it is not about sites, it is about brand owner coalition working together to make the brand even better, driven by the owners of the product and not the manufacturer, though having support since it is their customer base. Sorry for the run-on sentence, but it is a single thought. Sorry for not stating that up front. Why did I want to start here first on Vision-Riders (victory general)? Because I thought the audience is more mature and I didn't expect as many to be members and were not aware of the club. The entire intent is to get out of this rut that seems to plague the Victory Motorcycle Club. I would like to see a positive change in all the Victory riders to understand that there is strength in numbers and a lot more fun at it too if we recognize what direction we need to take. Nearly every rebuttal or post on a thread to make things better is met with opposition. Everyone keeps dragging the website forums into it, I'm just using it as a communication tool to say "Hey fellow Vicsters, lets get our act together, together." I've asked that this thread be frozen, and I expect it at anytime because it was not meant to generate this gyration over forums. This site is dedicated to the brand just as much as the theVMC forums are. However, this site is not a club, the VMC in and of itself is. It's not likely a new club will start up, the VMC has been at it since the beginning of Victory motorcyles, so why not take it to a new level. I'll be posting over there to get the negative off of here and get it over there, sadly.
Stick with the idea of promoting the brand. Harley has it figured out, thus their continued strong existance, despite numbers etc. Just this morning the local paper had a headline of Bikers Rally For a Good Cause. The first thing that popped in my mind was HOG, and I was right. It's not likely if I went I'd hear a lot of club politics and how the forum sucks. Everything will be in a positive light, and they'll probably have a few more HD owners in short order because they stick together.
Okay, I'll shut up and wait for the next one come back with "we tried that one before but it didn't work", because it's not likely someone will say "man, let's get this thing going, it's a great idea".
It's not too late to move the VMC in a positive direction and get it where it ought to be... man what am I saying...?
Edited by Cap'n Nemo 2011-03-24 12:01 PM
| |
| | |
Visionary
Posts: 1359
New Bohemia, Va | Jedi Jeff - 2011-03-24 11:47 AM
Cap'n Nemo - 2011-03-24 11:50 AM
I see that I'm failing at my mission and I guess it might be best to pack my bags and go away. If you see me on the road, wave, I'll be the one on the Midnight Cherry Classic Vision with the big smile on my face.. If you all want to join my club, come on.
Chris - by all means, don't go away. Your insight is just as valuable as everyone else's here. I hope you (and everyone for that matter) are just as evangelical about Vision-Riders on the VMC and VOG forums.
That was why I asked that, aside from the club aspect, what is Vision-Riders lacking?
Yes Jeff, I am, I live up to being a cheerleader of Vision and Vision-Riders, and I've even done business cards with www.vision-riders.com and theVMC.com on them. Like I said, you guys are doing everything right in an internet forum.
As a club, we can have one focus, one voice, the websites just get into the details. | |
| | |
Puddle Jumper
Posts: 19
| All I can say is start fixing your house in your house not in someone else's... I guess I am hung-up on internet protocol and dont know why you are trying to promote members on a competing site (there is a term for this). These easiest way to promote the brand is not by trying to recruit members but maybe (and this is far out there) just talk with the moderators of each site and get them to work together... | |
| | |
Visionary
Posts: 1359
New Bohemia, Va | So, as a fellow Victory owner I can count on you? If Jeff and Miles were trying to start up a club, a) this would have been deleted, b) they would have told me to stop, or c) I would join it and never brought this up. That's the first problem we have is as owners we don't all have the vision (no pun intended) to further the brand in a more cohesive and positive light. Sure, I know some don't care either, I use to not at all, but all we continue to do is work against ourselves. I see ZERO competition between VOG - VMC Forums - Vision-Riders, nil, none, zip. They all speak for themselves and they all meet a need. Some are on all three, some are on two, some are on one. So I think you are missing my intent entirely. As far as internet protocol, that's a laugh all to itself, not trying to be insulting or anything, but the internet is a free-for-all and there is no protocol unless you are using it illegially.
So, back to my point, as a fellow Victory rider, are we together on this, can I count on you? | |
| | |
Puddle Jumper
Posts: 19
| The internet is a free for all when you are paying the bill. These sites recieve very little money from banner ads and stuff like that most of the moderators are going into there own pocket because they are passionate about what they are doing. Whether you believe so or not they are in competition with each other to grab their share of a very small market. So I still do find it offensive and the proper term is trolling. When I wanted to post something about the VOG meetup on the VMC I followed proper protocol and pm'd Kevin and asked his permission first. Then when I posted the thread I started it out by saying that this is not a recruiting thread and it was approved by admin.
As far as help goes, if you are asking for my help with the VMC I would gladly help you over there and give my suggestions. If you wanted to start a true Victory club I would suggest setting something up on Meetups.com and promote it as a riding group for Victory owners. That way you truley are not a forum but a club.
From what I am reading you want the VMC to be the only riding club in the country for Victory?
I dont see us working against each other, I see you trying to push your agenda on me. Thats fine, I can push back and that is the exact reason I am not active on the other site. You probably do not know me but there are probably only a handful of people that spend more time promoting Victory and my dealer more then myself. I sit here in the background and r... oh never mind... | |
| | |
Visionary
Posts: 1359
New Bohemia, Va | okay, you've made your point Don. I'm fully aware of what the internet is all about from top to bottom and had successful websites that had its own niche, but I never competed, I let it speak for itself and it served its purpose for the time. Victory is not that big to start with, a very small slice of the pie of the motorcyle world.
I'll say one thing, Victory riders are really loyal to their bikes but not so much to others that ride Victorys, at large. Sure, there is the pocket, cells, cliques, whatever we want to call it, and it continues to sing the same old song. I hope that we'll get past that, but for now you say its a bad idea. I just caught onto the fact that Harley has HOG and Goldwing has GWRRA, and they are what they are, the largest group of faithful riders.
I was part of the GWRRA while I had my wing and I saw positive things, especially with the book every year with the member participation in it, like the RRDB. That's some good stuff, and I'm sure HOG has that too. That doesn't keep other "clubs" from standing up, but there will be one that will have the greatest number for the greatest cause, the rest will benefit from, even if it is residual. I'm not a member of ABATE or AMA, but applaude them because of the voice they have for all of us, each that speaks for us in different respects.
Currently the VMC is the largest representation of victory owners we have, I just want to encourage those to come together on a positive note, steer the club, for the members, by the members in a good direction. I have no agenda to push on you at all, you never had to respond, I know not everyone will join up. In all honesty I have no dog in this fight whatsoever, nothing to gain, nothing to lose, only the hope that those of us who love the brand will come together positively, have a strength that can speak in one voice to Polaris/Victory and continue to support them to build a great product. But okay, you win....
Edited by Cap'n Nemo 2011-03-24 1:21 PM
| |
| | |
Tourer
Posts: 520
Simi Valley, CA | Frankly I agree 100% with everything that Chris has said. As a paying member and visitor regularly of all three forums I feel that I can chime in here too. This forum is a great resource for Victory owners. The members are helpful, open and honest. I have always been treated fairly and gotten great feedback on any issues or questions.
The VMC I actually joined before buying my Vision, in hopes that , since they have 'local' chapters, they would be more of the Victory riding organization, similar to the SCRC, only Victory centric. While there are chapters that are that way- most I see are not. That's okay too. It wasn't what I thought. I assumed- yes I did, that it would be similar to the HOG organization. My mistake. In addition, the feedback and rants I see on the VMC, some get downright nasty. Just for an example, when Mr Wizard posted his new exhaust tips here, it has like 22,000 views and pages of comments. When he did the same thing on the VMC forum, the responses were, shall I say, less than positive. The VOG net is an information source, great videos- I don't go there as frequently.
My feeling is that each of the three resources are unique, a good thing. They don't compete otherwise they could not all survive. I wish that Mother V would take a look at the VMC, and support it by giving each bike purchased a year membership to the group. Then maybe, get their dealer network to support the VMC, some chapters have been able to do this- I feel this is a way that growth of the VMC, Vision-Riders and VOG and the BRAND can be guaranteed.
Tim | |
| | |
Visionary
Posts: 1359
New Bohemia, Va | there's always someone that can and will say it better than I can, thanks Tim! Live long and perspire... (on a california desert highway...) | |
| | |
Puddle Jumper
Posts: 19
| Cometman - 2011-03-24 2:43 PM
My feeling is that each of the three resources are unique, a good thing. They don't compete otherwise they could not all survive. I wish that Mother V would take a look at the VMC, and support it by giving each bike purchased a year membership to the group. Then maybe, get their dealer network to support the VMC, some chapters have been able to do this- I feel this is a way that growth of the VMC, Vision-Riders and VOG and the BRAND can be guaranteed.
Tim
That would be like political suicide for the factory. We have members here that dont go to the other sites because they dont want to read about anything but a Vision. The VOG has it's loyal die hard members that dont go to the other two and the VMC has its die hards. Why would the factory want to distance themselves from any of the groups? Just does not make good business sense in this economy. I am not going to post the numbers but it would probably shock people to find which Victory sites have the most traffic and "active" members.
Also, if Mama V gives its support to the VMC how does that help the growth of the VOG and Vision-Riders? If you want growth in the brand, hanging with people of the same brand doesnt help. When I pull up to a biker spot with my LE I get allot of attention from the HD crowd. It being #1 is a real talking point, I hand out my cards and tell them to visit the site and write my dealers address and number on the back and tell them to go in for a test ride. I went to Sanford Thunder in the Streets and Biketoberfest in Daytona and volunteered at my dealers tent answering questions. I think I was directly responsible for 2 bike sales. That's how you grow a brand, not by hanging out with people that are already riding the same bike. | |
| | |
Iron Butt
Posts: 965
New York State | Ok I'm crazy but to me if you want a friend try being friendly. I am part of a Fraternal Org I was born in to it. It claims to be about Brotherhood but I can site no examples.
I have siblings they have no choice about me they are family.
I have thousands of brothers across the world we have one thing in common we ride bikes I have never met them all or ever will.
The ones I met for the most part were being brotherly to me others I have met by being that to them.
Sure some have walked away and cursed me or I them.
I don't let that keep me from offering a cell phone or a ride to someone in a jam
This site is a true Niche It has carved out a place in Cyberspace that it maintains with quality.
I trust the information that I read here.
{ Gets off Soap box}
Edited by Trekwolf164 2011-03-24 5:36 PM
| |
| | |
Cruiser
Posts: 216
Danville, CA | My opinion is the site should be transferred, ported over to Facebook. Its where alot of people go and the interface and updates on your phone are nice and at your finger tips. You asked..  | |
| | |
Tourer
Posts: 432
Gettysburg, 2008 Tour Premium | I spend very little time with VMC but did pay the dues. In my second year now. About 6 months after I joined I posed a question why the picture of the Fallen serviceman still is front and center on the home page of dues paying club websight. I did not know who he was but I suggested that the same privilage was offered to anyone in the club. I will have to say that the response from a few as to the attack was supportive the overall feeling was similar to the same hardass BS I hear spouted on any number of H-D forums. My feeling is i expect equality of service if dues are charged. I used to own a Goldwing and I loved the community grown up around the Goldwing, same goes for the BMW riders. I think This forum excels in keeping on topic and I love the fact that there are no GURU's or elder statesmen that lead the frey. Keep up the good work. | |
| | |
Cruiser
Posts: 185
Rhode Island | I am a member of 2 and was a member of the third but got tired of it quickly. This has been my favorite for the last 8 months or so; this has become my favorite because it stayed more focused about the bikes and less BS (hopefully posts like this won't pop up more often). The site that I dropped was run by a nice guy but a wanna be (rode for like a year then sold) who actually talks too much about stuff I'm not interested in. The other site has lots of information and I have met many great people throughout the north east because of it; I get aggrivated with all the drama sometimes.
This site is the most focussed on the bikes, information and riding; good job Jeff and thank you.
Jim | |
| | |
Visionary
Posts: 1359
New Bohemia, Va | Until folks get off of the internet forums and focus on the coalition of brand owners through a single enitity this will never move forward. At this point it doesn't matter if it is through theVMC, which has its beginnings from the start of Victory Motorcycles, or another association that needs to band together the largest segment of owners. The point is to do something that will work toward the being the voice to the manufacturer and to promote the brand and help strengthen a dealer network.
Since being a Victory owner for a little more than three years I've learned that while Victory owners think they are different, they are, we are, the same as every one else. We complain of the competition, but they must still being doing something right as evident of the strong following that keeps the brand alive. So instead of saying, they suck and we're better, why not band together and be better. That is where I lose it because all we want to talk about is the forums -- that was never my intent.
So the idea that I've conveyed in wanting to move us forward has died on the vine again, given credience to the cliche "we've tried that before and it didn't work." Okay, it works for everyone else, why not Victory!?
I've gone riding....
Edited by Cap'n Nemo 2011-03-31 8:48 AM
| |
| | |
Iron Butt
Posts: 965
New York State | I can't figure out what you are looking to accomplish Nemo people who bought Victory's are supporting the company.
Do you want Victory owners to own more than one ?
Do you want Victory owners actively seeking to hurt other motorcycle manufacturers or owners ?
Are Victory owners supposed to tatoo Victory across their foreheads ?
I bought a motorcycle to enjoy on the roads I did not want to join a cult ,
or I would have bought an HD or a Wing. | |
| | |
Visionary
Posts: 1359
New Bohemia, Va | As I said, I've gone riding on this one, for two reasons.
1) rabbit holes
2) forums rat nest
My purpose is to drive the grassroot effort from a single voice to the manufacturer for better support, stronger dealer network, and a positive promotion of the brand for the good of all. Nothing more, nothing less. | |
| | |
Iron Butt
Posts: 965
New York State | Polaris does not have a great track record for helping dealers in fact some say the opposite.They want the $$$ from customers but if you try to contact them you get a form letter response and little else. Less message boards means less public involvement IMHO. the fact that many belong to two or more means more exposure and more reasources.
One man can point out an error, a collection of people can make a difference.IMHO.
I think one voice is to easily ignored. Ask my pillion. | |
| | |
Tourer
Posts: 554
2 mi from Jim Beam n KY | Chris, I'm with ya.
Harley has the H.O.G. and Victory has .............nothing really. Victory needs a large factory sponsored Owners Group. The VRA doesn't cut it at all.
The VMC does more than any other group to promote Victory, with national, regional and local rides. The local VMC clubs seem fairly strong, although there's obviously room for growth. The regions need a little work. But I support the VMC and pay annual dues. I've been in part of the discussion for starting a local VMC chapter here.
The VMC is in the best position for the job, but the forums need a little bit of policing. I never know which thread has deteriorated into a cursing, flaming free for all. I don't want to read that kind of crap. I would imagine Corporate Victory wants no part of that either. This is one of the many reasons I'm so pro Vision-Riders. Ya'll disagree frequently, but it doesn't turn into a flame fest. You folks stay civil. I seriously hope Kevin can fix the few things that are holding the VMC back. He has my support, for what ever that's worth!
For reasons beyond me, I suspect Victory doesn't want, or think they need a H.O.G. I believe they are in error.
VR still needs long sleeve white t-shirts. | |
| | |
Iron Butt
Posts: 965
New York State | I really think the Dealerships need to band together and make Victory responsive. As consumers we only yea or nah with our purchase. It is the Dealership who is our only contact with Victory. | |
| | |
Visionary
Posts: 1359
New Bohemia, Va | wolf, I'm only an observer but I have come to learn that even though the dealer has to meet certain criteron and maintain it, Victory does not support them like Harley does their dealers. I find it really perplexing that Polaris dealers can shun Victory motorcycles and sell other brands right next to Polaris. This makes me look at the Victory dealers like they are selling Avon or Edible Arrangements, they live and die on their own efforts. That's not to say Victory doesn't assist some how but as far as dealerships being our voice, they are with us the owners nearly on the same plain.
But let us continue being a bunch of lone wolfs or little bands around the country and we'll be having the same problems and the same questions five years from now. It's been 12 years and so little has changed and the only real driving force of Victory making superior bikes is their bottomline. Now with that said they do listen to be able to build a better bike, but they know that is what drives the bottom line, so if they are doing fine what do they care if you don't have a local dealer or better support?
Edited by Cap'n Nemo 2011-04-07 10:35 AM
| |
| | |
Iron Butt
Posts: 965
New York State | My Dealer www.locomotionpowersports.com in Suffern NY sell Victory's Triumph's and Polaris off road vehicles. It is because of the Triumphs I found them, and My Vision. Not every rider is ready to jump on over 1000 cc's of machine and go.
By having Triumph's and servicing all makes of motorcycles
They expose the Brand to people who may have never even thought about owning a Victory.
plus the test rides are a big seller
Edited by Trekwolf164 2011-04-07 3:51 PM
| |
| |
|