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Puddle Jumper
Posts: 28
| I am looking for input on a VV handling changes after installing the lowering clevis. Does lower help handling at low speed? Does it help stability at high speed? What is the downside, like getting in and out over entrances?
Looking for some input from folks who have put on some miles after lowering. |
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Visionary
Posts: 4278
| I dropped my vision 1 inch and have no problem. Yes you have to put a block of wood down when putting it on a air lift or in a trailer. Oil pan still slids under just fine. You have to adjust your headlight and your belt.
Handling hasn't changed at low or at 116 mph.
Yes you have to go slow out of drive ways with drop offs and you have to watch out for speed bumps.
I'm running 30 pounds in the shock and I'm 210. I don't ride dirt or gravel roads nothing down them worth seeing.
You have to keep a eye out for pot holes and high drive ways.
I would do it again and its not that expensive to do. Just tell your self the bike is lower every day you through your leg over and it will be come second nature
to keep en eye out. |
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Visionary
Posts: 1229
Rancho Cucamonga, CA | I strongly recommend the Ness Skid Plate if you do lower it. I have several scrapes on mine already. |
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Puddle Jumper
Posts: 28
| john frey - 2011-05-12 8:15 PM
I dropped my vision 1 inch and have no problem. Yes you have to put a block of wood down when putting it on a air lift or in a trailer. Oil pan still slids under just fine. You have to adjust your headlight and your belt.
Handling hasn't changed at low or at 116 mph.
Yes you have to go slow out of drive ways with drop offs and you have to watch out for speed bumps.
I'm running 30 pounds in the shock and I'm 210. I don't ride dirt or gravel roads nothing down them worth seeing.
You have to keep a eye out for pot holes and high drive ways.
I would do it again and its not that expensive to do. Just tell your self the bike is lower every day you through your leg over and it will be come second nature
to keep en eye out.
Thanks for the reply John,
Are you running the stock exhaust? It appears I will have the D&D slipon's when the bike gets back from NY. Just wondering what I will be faced with if I get it lowered. I would lower it for two reasons, 1) to help stability at high speed and 2) seems my legs don't go up as high as they used to.
We are looking into front end changes for 1) as well. |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 669
Peachtree City, GA | I have lowered 5 Vision so far using an adjustable link in the rear. They have ranged from 3/4" to 2" and not had any problems with the handling. Like someone has stated you need to watch out for pot holes (I do anyway) and driveways, ramps for a trailer etc.
On the front you can just slide the forks up into the triple trees a little. I think the max is about 3/4"
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Visionary
Posts: 4278
| I have stock pipes on mine but just in case I go out drive ways with drop offs slow so the pipe doesn't catch.
I should have told you watch out when backing into a curb you will hit the pipe and of coarse no driving off curbs.
I don't know how big you are or your girl friend but you just play with the air in the shock and you should be ok.
Your profile doesn't say where you like so no body could swing buy and let you find out.
I don't have the trunk on the bike so now my right leg doesn't have any bruises for the grab bars.
Yes you will scrap in corners but I did when it was stock. You just have to learn how far over you can go and when your with the harley guys you can scrap just to prove a point that you can ride better then them.
Are you going to lower the bike your self or go to a shop? |
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Puddle Jumper
Posts: 28
| Hey John,
I am looking at the front forks and lowering before the bike gets back to me. I will be running some serious HP/TQ and want the most stability I get get on a VV. No tank slappers if I can help it. I may run it at Brainard DS.
So I am looking for input from folks who have done some chassis work on the VV and can give me a clue or two. The bike will always be a touring bike but go like hell occasionally. |
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Puddle Jumper
Posts: 28
| Sorry Duplicate
Hey John,
I am looking at the front forks and lowering before the bike gets back to me. I will be running some serious HP/TQ and want the most stability I get get on a VV. No tank slappers if I can help it. I may run it at Brainard DS.
So I am looking for input from folks who have done some chassis work on the VV and can give me a clue or two. The bike will always be a touring bike but go like hell occasionally.
Edited by smknal 2011-05-14 10:23 AM
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Visionary
Posts: 4278
| Because of the way the bike is built I have never read about any one having tank slapping.
You can lower the front by a inch real easy. Put spacers on the handle bar bolts and slid the forks up. Any thing more then that you have to pull the front end and put in new springs and maybe damping rods. The two I know that would have information on doing it would be Arlen ness tech dept or Mike at heavy metal.
Mike sells a triple trees from ness that will give you room to put a 21" up front. |
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Puddle Jumper
Posts: 28
| Here is an old u-tube with a lot going on in it, not saying this is a perfect example, but maybe close. You can see the dude has a bit of head shake, then drives into the dirt. May have gotten a bit light in the front end due to a dip in the rode?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9iC14h-i3Ns&feature=player_embedded
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Visionary
Posts: 4278
| He looked like he got into a road rut not a wobble.
Harley electric glides are naturist for tank slappers. When you going down the road and your front end shakes so hard that I don't care who you are you can't stop it from shaking. It shakes so fast your brain doesn't know what to do for sure.
Lowering your bike doesn't have any thing to do with tank slapping. Check the net and you'll find thousands of law suites against harley cause of the tank slapping. Most will tell you the slapping comes from the lack of a back motor mount on there rubber mounted motor or low tire pressure. Tank slapping comes from the read of the bike. |
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Cruiser
Posts: 61
Southeast Idaho | looks to me like he came up way fast on a blind corner and panicked because of not knowing whats on the other side then hit the front brake. If you notice the front end dives befoe the wobble begins, and notice his shadow as the bike dives he appears to raise an excessive amount in the seat. Also notice at about 32 seconds into the vid, you will see his right hand jam the front brake. Definetly rider error. |
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Visionary
Posts: 3006
San Antonio, TX | The person in the video is a long time member here on Vision-Riders.com named Spock.
Here are some threads where this video is discussed at length. I hope the information in these threads helps everyone get where they want to go...safely.
Get well soon! - Vision crash video
http://www.vision-riders.com/bb/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=4346&sta...
Vision Crash - Linked braking ????
http://www.vision-riders.com/bb/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=4355&sta...
Ride Safe
Edited by radioteacher 2011-05-24 8:19 PM
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Cruiser
Posts: 61
Southeast Idaho | nice write-up, good information and great points to think about
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Puddle Jumper
Posts: 28
| I wonder if he ever got the Traxxion suspension on that VV and what the results were. I am still unsure as to the advantages of suspension modifications on a VV. If a guy was going to be running a big motor in a VV and doing it fast occasionally what would be the recommendations? |
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Visionary
Posts: 3006
San Antonio, TX | smknal - 2011-05-25 12:35 PM
I wonder if he ever got the Traxxion suspension on that VV and what the results were. I am still unsure as to the advantages of suspension modifications on a VV. If a guy was going to be running a big motor in a VV and doing it fast occasionally what would be the recommendations?
Shoot Spock an message via Vision-Riders.com and I am sure that he will let us all know.
Ride Safe |
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Tourer
Posts: 495
Carrollton, TX | radioteacher - 2011-05-25 2:30 PM smknal - 2011-05-25 12:35 PM I wonder if he ever got the Traxxion suspension on that VV and what the results were. I am still unsure as to the advantages of suspension modifications on a VV. If a guy was going to be running a big motor in a VV and doing it fast occasionally what would be the recommendations? Shoot Spock an message via Vision-Riders.com and I am sure that he will let us all know. Ride Safe Suspension is KING! All bikes stock have poor suspension compared to what is possible. I know many riders that no matter what bike they buy they have aftermarket suspension put on before it leaves the dealer. The Vision has a good suspension from the factory but it can't compete with what Traxxion has done. Once you get 30K to 40K miles on the bike you can really notice the difference. If I would have had a Traxxion suspension on my bike I don't think I would have had my wreck. I could go into a lot more detail but don't have the time now. Kevin X has ridden Lobsterhunters Vision with the Traxxion suspension and he was amazed at the difference. If Victory does some big changes to the Vision for 2012 I will buy one and if not I will put the Traxxion system on my current 2008 Vision. I have ridden Gold Wings with the Traxxion suspension and the improvement is awesome. A good suspension can save your life! |
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Cruiser
Posts: 60
Vancouver, B.C. & La Quinta, CA | Did 1" on front and 2" on rear. Rides well, watch for speed bumps and install Ness skid plate |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 880
Orlando, FL | Get an 8 Ball seat and an 8 Ball shock. Each drops you one inch. I LOVE my 8 Ball and it handles like a dream~ |
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Puddle Jumper
Posts: 48
East Tennessee | I am going to lower my 2010 Vision with a 1" lowering link. I was told by mechanic at the dealer that I wouldn't have to do anything else to the bike except adjust the air shock pressure to my liking. I only plan on doing one inch in the rear. My question is, will I have to also lower the front ? Is it necessary to adjust the headlight ? Belt ? Etc/ |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 880
Orlando, FL | CorvettePoor - 2011-08-15 9:29 PM
I am going to lower my 2010 Vision with a 1" lowering link. I was told by mechanic at the dealer that I wouldn't have to do anything else to the bike except adjust the air shock pressure to my liking. I only plan on doing one inch in the rear. My question is, will I have to also lower the front ? Is it necessary to adjust the headlight ? Belt ? Etc/
Don't think so. My 8 ball Vision is one inch lower in the back and nothing different in the front. Handles great!! |
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Cruiser
Posts: 81
Salinas, Ca. | You will have to adjust your belt or at the very least take a good look at it to make sure its not too tight. I lowered my Vision 1" front and rear and didnt adjust the belt initially. Why you ask, cause it didnt "seem" to be too tight. As soon as I put the trunk on and loaded the bike with our luggage and the wife, the belt was extremely tight!!!!! As far as the headlight goes, it did not need adjustment. |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 669
Peachtree City, GA | MaddMAx2u - 2011-08-15 9:33 PM
CorvettePoor - 2011-08-15 9:29 PM
I am going to lower my 2010 Vision with a 1" lowering link. I was told by mechanic at the dealer that I wouldn't have to do anything else to the bike except adjust the air shock pressure to my liking. I only plan on doing one inch in the rear. My question is, will I have to also lower the front ? Is it necessary to adjust the headlight ? Belt ? Etc/
Don't think so. My 8 ball Vision is one inch lower in the back and nothing different in the front. Handles great!!
Actually the 8-ball Vision is lower in the front as well. Use your fist and place it between the fender and the headlight on both an 8-ball and standard Vision.... Part numbers for the components of the forks are also different between the 8-ball and the rest...
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Iron Butt
Posts: 880
Orlando, FL | Webhair, I'll try to find time to check that out. I did not see that in any of the specs I read and I had to work hard to verify the specs I got. Everything I found was pretty specific saying that the lower seat heght was the result of the seat itself being 1 inch lower and the rear shock being lowered one inch. But hey, you could easily be correct as I have found that getting accuate info on the Vic is sometimes extremely difficult! |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 802
| Between the Tour and the 8-Ball the springs are shorter, the valving is different and the preload spacers are much longer. I've used those pieces on both my '10 and '11 Tours and the improvement in ride is amazing solo or two up. If you're curious just sit on a Tour and move the front suspension and then do the same thing on an 8-Ball. The 8-Ball is much plusher. A side benefit is that you can disassemble an 8-Ball fork without a spring compressor when it comes time to flush the oil. The front end ends up very slightly lower but not enough to make any difference in cornering or on the side stand. The 8-Ball and the Tour have the same side stand part#, BTW. If you'd like to make the same mods let me know and I'll send you the part#s. From a ride quality stand point, its the best mod I've made.
Marc
Edited by marcparnes 2011-08-16 11:16 AM
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Iron Butt
Posts: 802
| Webhair - 2011-05-13 10:01 AM
On the front you can just slide the forks up into the triple trees a little. I think the max is about 3/4"
On the '11 and '12 you can barely get 1/4" before the cap nut hits the handlebars. Not worth the trouble.
Marc |
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Visionary
Posts: 4278
| I do recommended a short kick stand. You will find to many place the bike stands to straight up and down and will tip over on you.
Like I said I did the front and the rear and have not had any issue in corning going down the road. I have not bottomed out and have 30 psi in the shock when its just me and I'm 225. I do think the vision sits way to high in front and that makes for wiggling in my opinion. Of coarse the tire being at 40 psi doesn't help moving the bike around in the wind.
Here is a side note if you lower the bike and then go to a car tire get the 185 it will help keep you low.
http://www.hmd520.com/category/HMD-PARTS-1 |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 669
Peachtree City, GA | marcparnes - 2011-08-16 12:21 PM
Webhair - 2011-05-13 10:01 AM
On the front you can just slide the forks up into the triple trees a little. I think the max is about 3/4"
On the '11 and '12 you can barely get 1/4" before the cap nut hits the handlebars. Not worth the trouble.
Marc
True - I did not realize the cheaper bars on the newer models where that much different until I lowered a friends 11' a couple of weeks ago.
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Cruiser
Posts: 60
Vancouver, B.C. & La Quinta, CA | Good AM! My experience with my my Vision was; lowered 2" front and back (give or take a smidge) and used the Arlen Ness lowering kit which takes a small amount of saddlebag space but leaves me with full suspension travel. I added a skid plate and keep the rear suspension at about 18 lbs. I weigh in at 230 lbs. The bike handles better than when high, but I must add, BIG speed bumps are to be taken with caution. The bike actually handles better with this set-up. I use stock Dunlaps for rubber and overall, am pleased with the mods. Inexpensive way to improve handling and overall looks of the Vision IMO. Cheers |
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Puddle Jumper
Posts: 48
East Tennessee | DAL - 2011-08-16 1:58 PM Good AM! My experience with my my Vision was; lowered 2" front and back (give or take a smidge) and used the Arlen Ness lowering kit which takes a small amount of saddlebag space but leaves me with full suspension travel. I added a skid plate and keep the rear suspension at about 18 lbs. I weigh in at 230 lbs. The bike handles better than when high, but I must add, BIG speed bumps are to be taken with caution. The bike actually handles better with this set-up. I use stock Dunlaps for rubber and overall, am pleased with the mods. Inexpensive way to improve handling and overall looks of the Vision IMO. Cheers What is included in the Ness lowering kit ? Where would you purchase the kit and at what cost ? Thanks |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 669
Peachtree City, GA | Any dealer can order them from Ness. Ness doesn't seem to want to sell them to the public. I have purchased them from Arizona Victory and Off-Road Express in Erie PA. I understand that HMD50 (on this site) is also carrying them. They are call Ness Bag Inserts. I believe they were around $170 or so.
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Cruiser
Posts: 152
| Guys be very careful doing this I had mine lowered by cycle dragon and when I hit a really bad under cut on a entrance to a bridge with my wife I put the top of my belt pulley and brake disc right through the bottom of my bags |
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Cruiser
Posts: 60
Vancouver, B.C. & La Quinta, CA | Yes, I would agree. Two up and fully loaded is not the ideal for any lowered bike. Best to stay stock if that is your thing. |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 669
Peachtree City, GA | bob5219 - 2011-08-17 9:58 AM
Guys be very careful doing this I had mine lowered by cycle dragon and when I hit a really bad under cut on a entrance to a bridge with my wife I put the top of my belt pulley and brake disc right through the bottom of my bags
Did they install the Ness bag inserts before this happened? How low did they lower it?
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Iron Butt
Posts: 741
Central New York | OK, I'll let my ignorance hang out. Why? I have read through the whole thread, the problems or lack of, the methods and results, but I didn't see anywhere the why. It doesn't handle worse, nor better. From 25 feet away you really can't perceive a difference in looks. The only thing I have read that added to the bike was the ability to bottom out.
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Cruiser
Posts: 238
SF Bay Area | smknal - 2011-05-12 12:43 PM
I am looking for input on a VV handling changes after installing the lowering clevis. Does lower help handling at low speed? Does it help stability at high speed? What is the downside, like getting in and out over entrances?
Looking for some input from folks who have put on some miles after lowering.
While I haven't lowered mine, I do have a little comment... I feel the bike handles fine at low and high speeds, what is your specific handling issue? Downside? If you ride like me, my problem with lowering the bike would be losing much needed ground clearance while cornering, The Vision has little latitude between when the floorboards drag and when the front tip-over drags... which will likely lift the front tire, causing the front end to push (read, crash). Of course, lowering the bike will also reduce the ground clearance, you may drag hard parts over speed bumps. One of the real negatives is that your side stand, unless modified, will stand your bike near verticle when parked, you will have to be more careful about selecting where you park.
I would do the mod if...
1) I was not a fast corner rider
2) I had to, in order to reach the ground with confidence.
3) It looked cool
4) High quality parts could be had (they can...)
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Visionary
Posts: 4278
| <p><strong>Lower bike put more air in shock</strong> Handling is no different then before you still fly threw the twisty's you just might not lean over as far you did before but believe me me you still lean a lot. you go down the road the same and the wind doesn't seam to move you around as much. Parking lots are the same. You have lowered your center of gravity so you have be come more stable now.</p><p><strong>I have 30 psi in shock but after I first lowered it I had 40 psi. With two up and going on a trip maybe you will need 50 psi.</strong> You just have to play with it till you </p><p>find what you like. Yes keeping your eye open for pot holes really helps.<br /></p>
Edited by john frey 2011-08-18 1:33 PM
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Lowered vs handling