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Fountain Inn, SC United States | From MotorcycleNews.com:
 Pictures of five new Indians and a production version of the radical Victory Core concept have leaked to MCN after a reader was unwittingly targeted by an online research firm.
The six bikes - featuring dramatically different styles and powertrains from air-cooled vintage to girder-forked board-track - are sure to strike fear into the heart of Harley-Davidson, which it's now clear faces its most serious threat in generations.
Now owned by massively wealthly Polaris Industries, owners of Victory motorcycles, this is the first tangible sign of the extent of the firm's ambitions for America's oldest bike brand.
Currently engaged in the boutique production of high-end legacy cruisers exclusively for the US market, Indian is being moved in-house to Minnesota and groomed to take on Harley worldwide, backed by Polaris' 1.2billion annual revenues.
The full story and all images are in the July 13 edition of the magazine. The Indian Motorcycle Community (similar to Vision-Riders) has generally unfavorable reviews, mostly due to their fear it will be a Indian-Victory hybrid.
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Visionary
Posts: 2300
Georgia, west of Atlanta | A Indian -Victory hybrid ?? What the hell do they think they have now ?? It's a Harley Evo clone kit bike with Indian badging !!!!!!!! I don't care how nice the chrome and paint are, if a motorcycle dosen't have it's own engine type it ain't the real manufacturers bike. The last "real" Indians had narrow V 42 degree flathead engines of different displacements ( 45, 61, 74 & 80 inch ) and before that a very unique 4 cylinder 77 inch engine. The last "real" Indian was rolled out in 1953. I hope the next "real" one will be in in 2013, exactly 60 years later.........With an engine or engines unique to the brand.........I wish them good fortune with this........... |
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Visionary
Posts: 1359
New Bohemia, Va | Just remember the rulebook for the sucess or failure of anything is the pocketbook. Where they go from here will only be contingient on what will sell.
Right now there are a lot of well meaning people wanting to keep the brand alive within the heart of the original but bringing it up to modern day. I don't hear anyone screaming about wanting a retro goldwing and even the harley camp is getting tired of the some of the retro HD styling. I know what I want in the Indian and I love what they have with the 2009-2011 model years. I would love to be riding around on an old '48 or even a '53, but the newer models have done justice to those that have come before.
If they redesign keeping a hint of the iconic Indian look like in the picture above, they will do well. I stopped by the Charlotte dealer on Friday on the way down to Columbus, Ga and they told me the Blackhawk, the hardbag with some Art Deco styling seems to be a favorite. This tells me that to make a dime Indian will have to move forward with some restyling. They will do well to if they keep some of the retro styling also.
I think they'll do well, this is a great match - the oldest and the youngest American bikes.
Edited by Cap'n Nemo 2011-07-18 6:56 AM
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Visionary
Posts: 2300
Georgia, west of Atlanta | Cap, you're right the Blackhawk is the best looking one of the bunch. I saw one at the Charlotte/Gastonia store also, if they'll improve on that and give it a proper ( new ) engine and electronics they will have a winner........
(indian blackhawk 2011 (2).jpg)
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 indian blackhawk 2011 (2).jpg (49KB - 5 downloads)
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Iron Butt
Posts: 741
Central New York | Personally, I would not retain too much "Indian" design. If were that appealing to the biking public, Indian would be buying Polaris, not the other way around. It seems pretty obvious who is the better judge of what people like and are will to lay down cash for. |
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Visionary
Posts: 2300
Georgia, west of Atlanta | AND bigger saddle bags................. |
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Visionary
Posts: 1350
| I like the look of that concept bike.
"Harley Evo clone kit bike' time to catch up with the rest of the world. Indian came out with their own pancake engine in 2003. It didn't have EFI when I was looking at them. Of course that was the only year till the new owner turned them around and did a nice job. Sure the price is high for me but that doesn't make them a clone or a bad bike.
If you want to jump on an old bandwagon, go for when HD didn't follow specs and won the contract instead of Indian to build bikes for the military. |
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Visionary
Posts: 4278
| So I did a search of 2012 and it sounds like Vic might becoming out with a muscle dresser mode. Would that be something a 116 stock in a vision or a cross bike. Hang on |
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Tourer
Posts: 492
Indianapolis, IN | I have high hopes for the Polaris/Indian project. I know they didn't jump into this on a whim. So far they have been extremely good at hitting the mark on what the biker community likes. I know there will always be a segment that will be displeased at the final reveal, but I'm sure they will produce designs acceptable to the enthusiast that's chomping at the the bit to own one.
Hang in there guys, everything is a process of development and as I said I'm sure they are in it for the long haul. |
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Cruiser
Posts: 136
CALGARY ALBERTA | Look at what Victory has to offer and what Indian can garner.
Forward thinking engineering
Gear driven primary.
Hydraulic clutch
Proven fuel injection
Better frame dynamics
And a dealer network
Lower cost = lower prices |
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Visionary
Posts: 1359
New Bohemia, Va | glighto11 - 2011-07-18 9:24 AM
Personally, I would not retain too much "Indian" design. If were that appealing to the biking public, Indian would be buying Polaris, not the other way around. It seems pretty obvious who is the better judge of what people like and are will to lay down cash for.
I got to bone up on my Indian history a little more, but the looks is what keeps Indian coming back, bad business decisions is what keeps them going down. What I understand on the Gilroy era is they dumped a lot into dealer network also, but made a bad bike. By the time they figured that out they had a bad bike and made improvements, it was too late, again!
The King Mountain Indian is a premium bike and has the greatest modern day potential for an iconic bike, thus, Polaris with deep pockets made the decision to buy. Victory would not be here today had it not been for the deep pockets of Polaris, so let's not be to critical. |
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Cruiser
Posts: 80
| Polaris now owns the "oldest and newest American made" motorcycles. I also heard that Polaris CEO Scott Wine said if the Indians ever look anything like a Victory, "we have failed!"
Denny Pink
Fort Collins, CO.
2008 Vision
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Cruiser
Posts: 112
Denver, Iowa | Do you suppose the writing is on the wall for the Kingpin?
I sure hope that the powers-that-be give the engineers and designers the time and capital needed to thoroughly redesign whatever they see fit. Not to bash Vic's latest bike (because it is fun to ride!), but re-badging a Vegas while adding spokes and apes is not setting the world on fire. While the first new Indian bike will have it's own group of yea-sayers and nay-sayers, I'm hoping the design teams are allowed to strive to push the envelop to offer a design with style, comfort, power, reliability, cost, etc. And do it without crossing into Vic's own targeted consumers. The newest Indian will be the new baseline for that brand... then, make it better each year after that. It certainly won't be easy. Their work is cutout for them, but I'm also pullin' for 'em! |
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Visionary
Posts: 1359
New Bohemia, Va | No - Indian will have nothing to do with Victory's modeling. The hardest part of this buy is getting people to understand that there may be a share of technology and engineering, there will not be a morphing of styling. When it comes to marketing, there is two niches under the Polaris umbrella. Fence riders don't count, and general motorcycle enthusiast don't count, but there are die-hard Indian fans, to include the future ones, and then there is die-hard Victory fans.
I guess what I'm saying is, it is the spectulators that are morphing these bikes, not the mothership - their goal is for the two product lines to remain seperate and distinct. |
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Cruiser
Posts: 112
Denver, Iowa | Wow, general motorcycle enthusiasts don't count. I didn't know that about Polaris, that's for sure! I'll have to ask our regional sales rep what the deal is with that marketing plan. Thanks for the insight. |
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Visionary
Posts: 1359
New Bohemia, Va | That's my take - I base that off of the people who will buy a motorcycle just to say they had one. Those count as sales as well of course, but the mainstay customers are the ones who keep the business rolling and who turns over to a new bike every few years. That's the way I see it.
I don't count much either, I buy and then I wear that one out before I buy a new one. My car purchases are about 5 - 7 years a part and will usually buy used. My Vision is nearly four years old and I have no plans to buy a new bike anytime soon. |
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Tourer
Posts: 547
Mount Vernon, WA United States | Cap'n Nemo - 2011-07-19 10:03 PM
No - Indian will have nothing to do with Victory's modeling. The hardest part of this buy is getting people to understand that there may be a share of technology and engineering, there will not be a morphing of styling. When it comes to marketing, there is two niches under the Polaris umbrella. Fence riders don't count, and general motorcycle enthusiast don't count, but there are die-hard Indian fans, to include the future ones, and then there is die-hard Victory fans.
I guess what I'm saying is, it is the spectulators that are morphing these bikes, not the mothership - their goal is for the two product lines to remain seperate and distinct.
+1 |
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