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100K service.. sort of.
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BumbleDB
Posted 2017-05-02 12:41 AM (#191811)
Subject: 100K service.. sort of.


Cruiser

Posts: 52
Well, I figured I'd post this here as this is the only group of people that
might be inclined to care about such things.

My 13 is right at 99K miles. I had planned to do major work on it when it
passed 100K, but rear tire problems forced me to start the work early. This
old scoot has been top notch in the dependability department and has never
let me down. I don't even check the oil between changes as it's never used
any amount that I can detect with the dipstick. I check it before I drain
the oil, and it has always been full to the mark. The powertrain is under
warranty ( polistar insurance policy ) until 08/18, but I'm not counting on
that, IF anything should go wrong. I do believe the powertrain will outlast
the warranty.


What follows is a list of the work done for the 100K mark:

1) Replaced front and rear wheel bearings with hybrid ceramic.
The oem NSK bearings still felt fine and could of went a lot longer. The
ceramics are very smooth and quiet. Don't believe the shop manual, if you
do this, you will have to strip and bake the wheel. At room temp, the
bearing might as well be part of the wheel casting. 350 degrees, and
they'll drop right out.

2) Replaced the drive belt.
Oem was still fine and probably could have went another 50K easy.

3) Replaced right side swing arm needle bearing and sleeve.
Sleeve was damaged, had imprints from the needles in it. The left side
uses double stacked ball bearings, they were ok. Not sure why there are
two balls on one side and one needle on the other?

4) Replaced rear shock pivot shaft.
Shaft had heavy wear and was loose in the bore. Only way to replace the
bearings is to buy the whole rocker assembly for $220+ Bearings looked
and felt good. There was a whole long thread on one of the forums about
how soft the pivot shaft is. I'm sure at some point in the future I'll
be buying the rocker assembly.

5) Replaced throttle pull cable.
Nothing wrong with the old one... just seemed like a good idea. When I
was young, throttle cables used to break at the barrel about as often
as CC clutch cables do. They seem to be much better made these days.

6) Added QT throttle ring.
Wasn't too sure about this one, but it is a great add. Much easier
on the wrist, guess I should have done it long ago.

7) Replaced oem v-reg with mosfet.
Oem v-reg was rock solid, but it was getting old. It is now my spare.

8) Replaced oem plug wires.
Seemed like a good idea with the mileage.

10) Replaced S1-L1 mufflers.
Bike came new with these, not sure why. I had taken great care to keep
them from rusting and was quite proud of how well my work had held up
when I went to remove them for the belt job. Sadly, one had rotted on
the inside causing the conneting pipe to fall loose. Since it was the
only ones I could get quick, I went with the Big Honkers. These are
basically megaphones and not much else. They are loud. A little louder
than I'd like, but they do rumble! I wear custom molded ear buds hooked
to my radio, so I can live with it, but I feel sorry for anyone around
me.

Annnnnnnnd the big one:

11) Complete rebuild of the front forks using Traxxion Dynamics internals.
Up to 60K miles I had used Bel-ray oil. I had a seal go bad, so I
did a complete rebuild at that time, but the old bushings looked damn
good. After that I only used Victory fork oil, which seems to have been
a mistake. Not quite 40K later my forks were shot. The slide busings
were worn BAD. I knew the forks were hurting, you could feel it.
The Traxxion kit isn't cheap, but you get custom springs for your
weight and compression & rebound are adjustable on the fork caps.
This was a job, but seems very worth the money. Much better ride
and no front end dive.

BUT WAIT.... THERE'S MORE..

I'm waiting on a backordered part from pol, when ( if ) I get it
( or not ) I'll be replacing the oem cluch with a Barnett, also
replacing the shifter, star wheel, roller follower, and adding a
Factory Pro shift spring. I've got the shifter, cluch, and spring,
just waiting for the rest from PartsPitStop. Nothing wrong with the
oem clutch, just figured it's time. Still shifts fine, but I'm
sure the parts are worn.... we'll see.

Barring any other failures, custom paint will probably be next after
that.

I really like this scoot, hoping to get another 100K out it.
If the engine fails, I'll probably look for a salvage unit to get it
rolling and then try to rebuild the original as a BB. Guess it all
just depends on how scarce parts get.

Real shame about Victory. I developed a real distaste for Polaris
on the day I bought this bike, but I really love the machine. I've
always said the worst part of owning a Vic was Polaris, can't say
that anymore I guess.

Won't be buying anymore Pol machines, don't want to have to deal with
them ever again. If they had kept Vic, I might have been willing.
Probably not buying any HD scoots, too fragile. So after this I guess
it's back to the Asian stuff, if they're still making something
comfortable by then. I still have a crotch rocket, just getting too
old for the younger man bikes. The spirit is willing, but the body....

I'll keep this old Viz going as long as I can. If the wheels fall
off, I'll fix it and keep riding..... if I can get parts.
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rdbudd
Posted 2017-05-02 9:11 AM (#191812 - in reply to #191811)
Subject: RE: 100K service.. sort of.


Visionary

Posts: 1572
Jasper, MO
Great write up. Thanks.

Ronnie
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southjerseyrider
Posted 2017-05-02 3:12 PM (#191813 - in reply to #191811)
Subject: RE: 100K service.. sort of.


Cruiser

Posts: 291
Vineland, NJ United States

did you do anything with the rear shock itself? How many rear shocks did you go through in 100,000 miles? 

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Z-Man64
Posted 2017-05-02 7:25 PM (#191814 - in reply to #191811)
Subject: Re: 100K service.. sort of.


Puddle Jumper

Posts: 6
Sesser, IL United States
Thanks for sharing your experience, I hope my 16 Vision goes that long !!. I had a 13 XC and really enjoyed it but the Vision kept calling to me, only one ride and I was hooked. Thanks for the tip on the fork oil. Ride On.
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BumbleDB
Posted 2017-05-02 8:52 PM (#191815 - in reply to #191813)
Subject: RE: 100K service.. sort of.


Cruiser

Posts: 52
southjerseyrider - 2017-05-02 3:12 PM

did you do anything with the rear shock itself? How many rear shocks did you go through in 100,000 miles??



Original rear shock went bad at 60K miles, I think that was probably when the swing arm bearing sleeve was damaged.
The shock held air, but just didn't work very well.
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Thomas
Posted 2017-05-03 7:46 AM (#191816 - in reply to #191811)
Subject: RE: 100K service.. sort of.


Central Wisconsin

Thanks for sharing your 100K service, I really like your details.

I'm curious on what Mosfet voltage regulator you used?

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BumbleDB
Posted 2017-05-03 8:42 PM (#191817 - in reply to #191816)
Subject: RE: 100K service.. sort of.


Cruiser

Posts: 52
Thomas - 2017-05-03 7:46 AM

Thanks for sharing your 100K service, I really like your details.

I'm curious on what Mosfet voltage regulator you used?



Bought it off Amazon if I remember correctly. Been stockpiling these parts for a while. The vreg is a 'Sunchev' from China I think, but from what I could find out, all the mosfet retailers were selling the same exact Chinese part for varying amounts of money.

If you can find one that's not made in China, let me know.

So far it works quite well, paid just shy of $100.

Edited by BumbleDB 2017-05-03 8:48 PM
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Thomas
Posted 2017-05-04 7:50 AM (#191818 - in reply to #191817)
Subject: RE: 100K service.. sort of.


Central Wisconsin

Does this Mosfet V-reg look like yours .... tx.

 

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BumbleDB
Posted 2017-05-04 8:05 PM (#191821 - in reply to #191811)
Subject: Re: 100K service.. sort of.


Cruiser

Posts: 52
Exactly like the one I installed, even the wire lengths. The replacement has longer leads than the original. All the mosfets I found looked Identical, and the only true supplier I could find was in China. You can get them real cheap in bulk.
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beemerdad2@yahoo.com
Posted 2017-05-04 10:45 PM (#191822 - in reply to #191811)
Subject: RE: 100K service.. sort of.


Cruiser

Posts: 190
Good write-up and I'm glad you posted this. I just replaced the rear shock on my 2010 Vision so I shouldn't have to be concerned with that at 100,000 miles but I was planning on doing pretty much what you've done other than, possibly the ceramic bearings. I hadn't really thought about that to begin with. The bearings...or whatever's in the swing arm are probably my main concern come 100,000 miles and rebuilding the front fork is on the to-do list as well. Thanks for posting.

Edited by beemerdad2@yahoo.com 2017-05-04 10:46 PM
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beemerdad2@yahoo.com
Posted 2017-05-05 10:16 PM (#191823 - in reply to #191811)
Subject: RE: 100K service.. sort of.


Cruiser

Posts: 190
A question popped into my tiny head here and that's the V-regulator for the Mosfet unit. Is it a better performing reg? I forgot to mention I replaced my spark plug wires with a new set from Witchdoctor myself..more because they're 7 years old than because they weren't working as they should. Went with iridium plugs out of curiousity too...one of the speakers at the Dallas Bike Show in February highly praised them for those who ride long miles.

Edited by beemerdad2@yahoo.com 2017-05-05 10:19 PM
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BumbleDB
Posted 2017-05-06 3:15 AM (#191824 - in reply to #191811)
Subject: Re: 100K service.. sort of.


Cruiser

Posts: 52
The mosfet is supposed to switch faster and more efficiently producing less heat. The oem unit is an scr type that is the
cheapest design supposedly. There is another possibilty, but it requires minor modifications. Some guy on another
forum shows to to make the system only produce what is needed instead of just shunting the extra. Thought about doing
it, but the shunt system seems to work ok for me.


Edited by BumbleDB 2017-05-06 3:15 AM
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Pops
Posted 2017-05-13 12:33 PM (#191837 - in reply to #191811)
Subject: RE: 100K service.. sort of.


Cruiser

Posts: 176
Georgia On My Mind.... United States
Bumble,

Thx for the write-up.

Great post. I hope Lucilla will do as well as your Vision.
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BumbleDB
Posted 2017-05-13 9:21 PM (#191838 - in reply to #191811)
Subject: Re: 100K service.. sort of.


Cruiser

Posts: 52
Rolled over the 100K mark today on a vic group ride. Only took 3 years and 9 months.
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jimtom
Posted 2017-05-14 4:25 AM (#191840 - in reply to #191838)
Subject: Re: 100K service.. sort of.


Visionary

Posts: 1296
Sand Rock, AL United States
BumbleDB - 2017-05-13 9:21 PM

Rolled over the 100K mark today on a vic group ride. Only took 3 years and 9 months.


Congratulations, that's my kind of riding
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BumbleDB
Posted 2017-06-04 8:44 PM (#191956 - in reply to #191811)
Subject: Re: 100K service.. sort of.


Cruiser

Posts: 52
I figured I should update this since not all has went well.

1) Mosfet regulator: Fail. This was not a problem with the internals, but a problem
with assembly. They did a poor job of soldering the spade connectors on at the
Delphi connector causing a high resistance and burning out the center stator feed
wire on the regulator side. I saw a good bit of this when I was a mechanic.
Damaged the connector so it had to be removed. I was about 40mi from home
when it burned, but since I still had two working stator windings, I made
it home. Just had to hold the rpm at 1500 when I stopped to maintain 14.5V.
I could fix the wire on the regulator and I'm sure it would still work fine,
but I put the oem one back on and this week I'm going to look into doing the
series regulator conversion. The oem/mosfets are shunt regulators that keep
the stator charging at max and the reg dumps the extra power. Series regulators
work more like a car and only produce what the system needs. Supposed to be
much better for the stator, not as much heat. Even with the conversion, I
will still be able to swap back to shunt with very little modification if need be.
Both styles of regulator hook up the same way ( B+, B-, S1, S2, S3 ).


2) Ceramic bearings: Partial Fail. The higest load-bearing bearing failed. This
would be the rear wheel pulley side. The bearing had a plastic cage that could
pop out from one side, and so it did. I'm missing one roller, so I think one
came apart and pitched the cage, but the missing one could be hiding somewhere.
I did not count before I went to remove it and I may have just lost one. Not sure.
Lucky for me, I had a set of new SKF bearings ready to go if this were to happen.
Started the job at midnight last night and got it done well before sunrise, so I
could ( and did ) ride today. The front ceramic bearings are still in and feel
fine, and they have ~5k miles on them, but the one rear failed at ~3k miles.
Not sure if it was just a bad bearing, or just couldn't handle the load. The oem
NSK and replacement SKF bearings have a 2 piece metal cage that is riveted
together so it can't pop out one side, unless the rivets fail.
Sooo.. I guess I'll write this off as a worthy experiment that failed. Next front
tire change I'll probably pull the ceramics out and put the standard SKFs in.
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beemerdad2@yahoo.com
Posted 2017-06-05 12:00 PM (#191960 - in reply to #191956)
Subject: Re: 100K service.. sort of.


Cruiser

Posts: 190
Good write-up. I was curious about ceramic bearings myself...I've heard good things over the years but I'm a bit surprised they were in plastic races, (or whatever they're called), but maybe that was for lubrication? Might be wise to pull the front bearings as you're planning too. Again...good write-up.
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scottie409
Posted 2017-06-13 6:36 PM (#191992 - in reply to #191811)
Subject: Re: 100K service.. sort of.


New user

Posts: 2
when it comes to bearings if you can go to a bearing supplier with a bearing number or sample and they can provide either Chinese made bearings, Indian made bearings or if you are willing to pay Swedish made ones all the same part but variety of qualities
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rdbudd
Posted 2017-06-14 2:20 PM (#191998 - in reply to #191992)
Subject: Re: 100K service.. sort of.


Visionary

Posts: 1572
Jasper, MO
scottie409 - 2017-06-13 6:36 PM

when it comes to bearings if you can go to a bearing supplier with a bearing number or sample and they can provide either Chinese made bearings, Indian made bearings or if you are willing to pay Swedish made ones all the same part but variety of qualities


I prefer the American made bearings. Yes, they are readily available.

Ronnie
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BumbleDB
Posted 2017-06-14 7:21 PM (#191999 - in reply to #191811)
Subject: Re: 100K service.. sort of.


Cruiser

Posts: 52
Really? Who makes them and what brand name?

The SKF bearings I put in are made in Argentina.
The Chinese NSK bearings were still good when I pulled them, can't complain about those. They had just shy of 99K on them.

Got my series v-regulator kit, going to get around to installing it soon.
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rdbudd
Posted 2017-06-15 10:03 AM (#192003 - in reply to #191999)
Subject: Re: 100K service.. sort of.


Visionary

Posts: 1572
Jasper, MO
BumbleDB - 2017-06-14 7:21 PM

Really? Who makes them and what brand name?

The SKF bearings I put in are made in Argentina.
The Chinese NSK bearings were still good when I pulled them, can't complain about those. They had just shy of 99K on them.

Got my series v-regulator kit, going to get around to installing it soon.


INF, FAG, Barden, Timken all make bearings in the USA. There is a huge FAG bearing plant about 30 miles from me, in Joplin Missouri.

NTN are Japanese, or were the last time I got some for my Sport Cruiser. I got those from my local farm supply store. They had a whole drawer full of them. It's a very common bearing.

Ronnie
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flattop1us
Posted 2017-08-20 2:57 PM (#192176 - in reply to #191811)
Subject: Re: 100K service.. sort of.


New user

Posts: 1
124,000 on my 2009 vision that I bought in 2010 a hold over. The belt is original and rear brake pads are original. I change my your oil every 2500 miles and use rotalla 15/40
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jimtom
Posted 2017-08-21 5:26 AM (#192178 - in reply to #192176)
Subject: Re: 100K service.. sort of.


Visionary

Posts: 1296
Sand Rock, AL United States
155,000 on my 2008 Vision, original belt also.
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