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Cruiser
Posts: 92
Fort Walton Beach, FL | Has anyone had a dealer not disclose the rebate available on the bike they were buying? I just bought a VV premium which has a $1000 rebate and when I asked for it they said that it was part of the deal... Never mentioned it during our negotiations nor did they disclose it on the buyers order. Brings to mind the shady dealings that used car dealers used to close on their prey. Is the "rebate" for the consumer or is it considered "dealer cash"? Went thru this legal battle in the car business and the result was... if it is advertised as a rebate it is for the consumer and must be disclosed as such... if it is dealer cash it can be used at dealer discretion and need not be disclosed. Looks like I am in for a legal battle... I did stop payment on my check which had not cleared yet because the dealer would not hold everything until we could come to agreement. |
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Cruiser
Posts: 102
Cedar, Michigan | Dealerships are misspelled, it should be stealership. You have got to watch them like a hawk, every one car, bike, plane, train. |
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Tourer
Posts: 500
| I bought a new 2011 Vision Tour 3 weeks ago last Monday...The $1000 rebate had apparently just been announced on the Victory web-site the day before...My dealer was not aware of this and I brought it to their attention during our dickering over prices...No indication was made on my paperwork as to any rebate, but the deal seemed okay, not great but okay, so I went ahead and closed out....So far I love the bike and hope I got a fair deal which included the rebate........Good Luck... |
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Tourer
Posts: 374
Tucson, AZ | I have found that I hear about things much earlier on this site, than my dealer does. Now they check the website.....
mike |
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Cruiser
Posts: 62
| It can be difficult to prove what occurred in verbal conversations. However, EVERY dealer I spoke to when shopping for my bike DID verbally discuss the rebates, discounts, financing available on the bike I was considering. My "sales paperwork" does not list individual line items off original MSRP but rather simply shows the amount I paid for the bike and that is fine with me as I don't REALLY care of any specific paper trail but do/did want to ensure that they got down to the price point I required in order to do the deal.
On another note, I did sign the demo ride paperwork the day of the demo ride in order to qualify for that $1K discount that was used in addition to the discounts the dealer was offering. That particular $1K could have been considered to be applicable to "accessories" which in my case would have been used against the cost of the trunk.
In the end, I got a discount of between 10% and 20% off the MSRP of my particular bike. I am intentionally being vague as those figures will show you enough of a discount to recognize that I got what I needed off in order to justify my acquisition. Sure, I might have gotten 20% off which others might strive for but I'll tell you right now that with all discounts that would be hard for anyone to do...right?
Edited by ndabunka 2011-05-31 1:52 PM
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Cruiser
Posts: 92
Fort Walton Beach, FL | ndabunka - 2011-05-31 1:49 PM
It can be difficult to prove what occurred in verbal conversations. However, EVERY dealer I spoke to when shopping for my bike DID verbally discuss the rebates, discounts, financing available on the bike I was considering. My "sales paperwork" does not list individual line items off original MSRP but rather simply shows the amount I paid for the bike and that is fine with me as I don't REALLY care of any specific paper trail but do/did want to ensure that they got down to the price point I required in order to do the deal.
On another note, I did sign the demo ride paperwork the day of the demo ride in order to qualify for that $1K discount that was used in addition to the discounts the dealer was offering. That particular $1K could have been considered to be applicable to "accessories" which in my case would have been used against the cost of the trunk.
In the end, I got a discount of between 10% and 20% off the MSRP of my particular bike. I am intentionally being vague as those figures will show you enough of a discount to recognize that I got what I needed off in order to justify my acquisition. Sure, I might have gotten 20% off which others might strive for but I'll tell you right now that with all discounts that would be hard for anyone to do...right?
Your purchase did not nor does it even qualify for the $1000 rebate... maybe that's why it isn't on your paperwork? |
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Cruiser
Posts: 62
| Handyhoward - 2011-05-31 6:19 PM
Your purchase did not nor does it even qualify for the $1000 rebate... maybe that's why it isn't on your paperwork?
Sigh...Apparently you did not understand my "attempt" of equating the $1K demo ride discount's omission on my paperwork to your VV "discount"
....The $1K rebate for the demo ride was not listed on my selling paperwork
... The promotional interest rate was not on the paperwork either.
I also negotiated a deal discount...let's say it was for an additional $4K off the MSRP price.
.....THAT additional $4K discount was not on my final paperwork
Rather, the final sales paperwork shows...
.......$35,000 Sales Price (no line items for either the $4K "verbal" nor the $1K demo ride "discounts")
.......$25,000 down payment
.......$10,000 financed
One note: The "written quote" that I asked for BEFORE buying the bike DID show the discount for the Cross Roads "quote" I asked for when I was considering that bike.
Edited by ndabunka 2011-05-31 5:59 PM
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Visionary
Posts: 1229
Rancho Cucamonga, CA | On most vehicle sales, any rebates are off the MSRP of the vehicle. Once you start negotiating a "sale price", the rebates are considered included. If you are good at negotiating, you should be able to get a deal better than MSRP -discounts anyway. It does help as a barganing chip though, knowing you can go to any dealer and get that rebated price. Now the dealer will have to beat a lower price. |
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Cruiser
Posts: 92
Fort Walton Beach, FL | Nozzledog - 2011-06-01 1:25 AM
On most vehicle sales, any rebates are off the MSRP of the vehicle. Once you start negotiating a "sale price", the rebates are considered included. If you are good at negotiating, you should be able to get a deal better than MSRP -discounts anyway. It does help as a barganing chip though, knowing you can go to any dealer and get that rebated price. Now the dealer will have to beat a lower price.
Actually, by law here in Florida and many other states including California where you live, rebates are just that... a return of a monetary amount or added value AFTER a purchase of any durable goods or service. It is a non-negotiable dollar amount or added service and must be disclosed as a line item separately on a bill of sale or receipt if the consumer agrees to apply it to the transaction. It is also a taxable item which is the reason the state law requires it to be a separate line item. |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 741
Central New York | When I bought my Vision I did all the calculations at home. I knew the MSRP and I found all the applicable coupons, rebates, discounts, etc. and I knew an approximate dealer 'markup'. When I had all the information gathered I determined to myself what a fair price was and what I felt it was worth 'to me'. I approached the first dealer and found a Vision I liked. I told the dealer the price I had figured and told him I really didn't care what coupons, etc. he used to get there. He said he couldn't and I said me too. The third dealer took the deal.
I really don't know who got the best of who, and don't much care. I paid what it was worth to me. And without the theatrics. |
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Cruiser
Posts: 62
| glighto11 - 2011-06-01 10:45 AM
When I bought my Vision I did all the calculations at home. I knew the MSRP and I found all the applicable coupons, rebates, discounts, etc. and I knew an approximate dealer 'markup'. When I had all the information gathered I determined to myself what a fair price was and what I felt it was worth 'to me'. I approached the first dealer and found a Vision I liked. I told the dealer the price I had figured and told him I really didn't care what coupons, etc. he used to get there. He said he couldn't and I said me too. The third dealer took the deal.
I really don't know who got the best of who, and don't much care. I paid what it was worth to me. And without the theatrics.
Sounds VERY similar to my approach. I think what is different here is that the 'rebate' the OP recognized came out during his negotiations. In hindsight, the dealer says that he 'included' it in order to get to his final price but the use of that "rebate" wasn't fully disclosed at the time. I think that only the dealer and the OP can work this one out.
My comments to help him would be that if he got 10% off the list price, for him to "be happy and let it go". But, that is probably easier said than done. If the OP lives in a state where rebates HAVE to be documented, he may have recourse. |
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Cruiser
Posts: 92
Fort Walton Beach, FL | Worked it out with the dealer after the Attorney Generals office responded that if it is advertised as a rebate it is to the consumer and is a separate non-negotiable item... |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 1109
| Having managed new car dealers for years,unless the consumer assigns the rebate to the dealer the money is his or hers. |
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Rebates
