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Cruiser
Posts: 251
Mechanicsville, VA United States | Kevin, you started off your comment with "A properly set up VFC ", now complete it with how that's done! My answer to that is "Lloyd/Kevin/Rylan don't live anywhere close to me, my closest Victory dealer is 40 miles and they don't even know you guys even exist so how am I drinking the Koolaid? is it bc
I like the PC's, I like the VFC too, I just couldn't get it right....my bad I guess, but like I said earlier the only way to get the VFC perfect is on a Dyno with someone who knows how to operate it. |
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Visionary
Posts: 1340
Gainesville Fl Home of the Gators | diamonbird - 2013-05-21 12:51 PM
Kevin, you started off your comment with "A properly set up VFC ", now complete it with how that's done! My answer to that is "Lloyd/Kevin/Rylan don't live anywhere close to me, my closest Victory dealer is 40 miles and they don't even know you guys even exist so how am I drinking the Koolaid? is it bc
I like the PC's, I like the VFC too, I just couldn't get it right....my bad I guess, but like I said earlier the only way to get the VFC perfect is on a Dyno with someone who knows how to operate it.
nO DYNO NEEDED. jUST FOLLOW SOME SIMPLE INSTRUCTIONS[Sorry bout the cap lock]....
Start with all the setting off or to the left.
Find a nice clear ?closed course? to do the setting on.
GREEN:
Run steady at 30 mph in second gear. Add fuel to the green until the surging stops, then add one full point
YELLOW:
Run steady at 30 mph in second gear. Smack the throttle and concentrate on the acceleration feel. You should notice it getting better as you add yellow. Keep adding yellow until the acceleration feels mushy, then back off one full point from that setting.
RED:
Generally green plus one full point. If you want to play with it beyond that, try running at 60 mph in third gear. Do a hard roll on and concentrate on the way it pulls and how hard it pulls.
GREEN-BLUE:
Leave off. If you have read Lloyd?s instructions you know what this setting does and if you need it or not.
RED-BLUE:
Generally 2.5 to 3.
YELLOW-BLUE
Generally 2.5 to 3. |
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Cruiser
Posts: 251
Mechanicsville, VA United States | Okay that's simple enough! I didn't do that........I asked around on the forums and didn't find an answer that worked and I was always trying this number and that number, so I never got it where it felt right, the idle was not good at first start-up (cold), a lot of black smoke on acceleration, popping at shift point so like I said I couldn't get it right.... I'm glad I didn't though bc I love my PCV/AT300 cause all of those problems have disappeared. I still don't understand the Koolaid thing!? |
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Visionary
Posts: 1340
Gainesville Fl Home of the Gators | KoolAid is simply a reference to how many people are cheerleaders for one brand of something or another. It was not meant as an insult, but more an observation of how these threads seem to go. Sorry if I offended...It was not my intent |
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Visionary
Posts: 1229
Rancho Cucamonga, CA | "Drinking the KoolAid" means buying into a philosophy that goes against what a normal person would consider reasonable. It comes from the 1978 Jonestown Massacre where the cult known as "Peoples Temple", were facing charges for murdering a few members who wanted to leave the cult, decided to commit suicide by drinking a cyanide/KoolAid concoction instead. All 912 members drank it a died (except for the leader James Jones, who shot himself). |
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Cruiser
Posts: 251
Mechanicsville, VA United States | It's all good, forget it, I have! later |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 1117
Northeast Ohio | Kevin, I agree with what you said, in general. In 2009, I had Lloyd tune my bike in Daytona and it ran great while down there. Once I got back to Ohio, it was blowing smoke like a tractor at a tractor pull (sea level vs 1200ft above sea level in Ohio). Traveling to Sturgis last year for the first time, I discovered that they only had 89 octane fuel, not 91-93 like I have here in Ohio. When you take into account all the variables associated with getting a bike running well, this can all go south in hurry if you change anything after the tune (altitude, octane level, humidity, etc). If the VFC had a wideband O2 setup, I would get it. However, I have been running my PC-V for over a year now and have to tell you, after you get it dialed in for your area, you hardly ever have to accept trim values. I hooked my laptop up to my bike for the first time in two months and only had trim values of 1-2%. |
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Visionary
Posts: 1632
Jasper, MO | ScoreBo - 2013-05-21 6:08 PM
Kevin, I agree with what you said, in general. In 2009, I had Lloyd tune my bike in Daytona and it ran great while down there. Once I got back to Ohio, it was blowing smoke like a tractor at a tractor pull (sea level vs 1200ft above sea level in Ohio). Traveling to Sturgis last year for the first time, I discovered that they only had 89 octane fuel, not 91-93 like I have here in Ohio. When you take into account all the variables associated with getting a bike running well, this can all go south in hurry if you change anything after the tune (altitude, octane level, humidity, etc). If the VFC had a wideband O2 setup, I would get it. However, I have been running my PC-V for over a year now and have to tell you, after you get it dialed in for your area, you hardly ever have to accept trim values. I hooked my laptop up to my bike for the first time in two months and only had trim values of 1-2%.
You guys with the PCV are making me really, REALLY, glad I went with the VFCIII.
Reading your descriptions of it's operation gives the impression that the PCV seems to be really finicky and prone to losing its tune unless you spring for the auto-tune and stay on top of it all the time.
As I've repeatedly said, my VFCIII was tuned by the road test method (which is better than what can typically be accomplished on an inertial dyno), and the procedure was done the way Kevin outlined. My bike was initially tuned at 950 feet above sea level and runs just as good high up in the Rockies or in the Smoky Mountains. The VFCIII seems to stay in tune no matter what and the ECU compensates for altitude changes.
The VFCIII does not need the expense of the wideband O2 sensors--because it doesn't use any O2 sensors at all.
Whatever floats your boat...........
Now, if it would just quit raining and blowing hard around here..............
Ronnie |
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Visionary
Posts: 1340
Gainesville Fl Home of the Gators | Yup, riden bikes with VFC all over the country, and have never had to change set up. That is accomplished by the MAP/BARO, temp, air temp, and TPS. Open loop works just fine. |
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Cruiser
Posts: 60
Vancouver, B.C. & La Quinta, CA | Interesting rumour! My experience with both the Lllodz, PCV tuner & Auto Tune is simply 7 HP and 9 ft/lbs torque improvement with the PCV. The Lloydz gear is good for side of the road hand tuning, but the PCV (IMHO) measures fuel delivery in cells of 200 RPM all through the spectrum which makes for a more complicated install perhaps but better tuned results as I experienced. I gave my Lloydz unit to a friend with a new Vision and he is happy as a clam. having said that, he is not running a lot of performance gear. Hopes this helps. |
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Visionary
Posts: 4278
| To any but that does this. Make your self some notes.
What settings are working good for you. What didn't work.
You'll be surprised how confused you can get after a few trys or a month down the road.
Take your time don't rush |
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Visionary
Posts: 1340
Gainesville Fl Home of the Gators | DAL - 2013-05-24 3:56 PM
Interesting rumour! ?My experience with both the Lllodz, PCV tuner & Auto Tune is simply 7 HP and 9 ft/lbs torque improvement with the PCV. ? The Lloydz gear is good for side of the road hand tuning, but the PCV (IMHO) measures fuel delivery in cells of 200 RPM all through the spectrum which makes for a more complicated install perhaps but better tuned results as I experienced. ?I gave my Lloydz unit to a friend with a new Vision and he is happy as a clam. ?having said that, he is not running a lot of performance gear. ?Hopes this helps.
No rumor or even seat of the pants, data backed conclusions. I have dyno tuned several hundred Vics, and have a dyno cell 100 feet from where I am sitting |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 1117
Northeast Ohio | rdbudd - 2013-05-22 1:02 AM
ScoreBo - 2013-05-21 6:08 PM
Kevin, I agree with what you said, in general. In 2009, I had Lloyd tune my bike in Daytona and it ran great while down there. Once I got back to Ohio, it was blowing smoke like a tractor at a tractor pull (sea level vs 1200ft above sea level in Ohio). Traveling to Sturgis last year for the first time, I discovered that they only had 89 octane fuel, not 91-93 like I have here in Ohio. When you take into account all the variables associated with getting a bike running well, this can all go south in hurry if you change anything after the tune (altitude, octane level, humidity, etc). If the VFC had a wideband O2 setup, I would get it. However, I have been running my PC-V for over a year now and have to tell you, after you get it dialed in for your area, you hardly ever have to accept trim values. I hooked my laptop up to my bike for the first time in two months and only had trim values of 1-2%.
You guys with the PCV are making me really, REALLY, glad I went with the VFCIII.
Reading your descriptions of it's operation gives the impression that the PCV seems to be really finicky and prone to losing its tune unless you spring for the auto-tune and stay on top of it all the time.
As I've repeatedly said, my VFCIII was tuned by the road test method (which is better than what can typically be accomplished on an inertial dyno), and the procedure was done the way Kevin outlined. My bike was initially tuned at 950 feet above sea level and runs just as good high up in the Rockies or in the Smoky Mountains. The VFCIII seems to stay in tune no matter what and the ECU compensates for altitude changes.
The VFCIII does not need the expense of the wideband O2 sensors--because it doesn't use any O2 sensors at all.
Whatever floats your boat...........
Now, if it would just quit raining and blowing hard around here..............
Ronnie
Ronnie, I should have stated that in 2009 I was running a VFCIII (on my 2008). I am now running a PC-V on my 2011. It's not finicky at all. Lloyd has all my settings dialed in and I have the same experience everywhere I go. No fuss.. |
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Cruiser
Posts: 116
| Hey Kevin I used your technique to set up my VFC and it worked well but I was surprised how much fuel I had to add, I have the cams, ecm, filters and the advance wheel and when I did the cruise at 30 mph I had to add to the 4 level for it to smooth out..then I set it at 5. The bike smells a little rich but runs like a rocket. Is this common on the settings? (Don' t mean to hijack just trying to learn) |
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Cruiser
Posts: 244
| Wasn't going to say anything about mine but been having a little problem so I decided to shut down everthing & just set the green G=3 seems to run smooth in 2nd @30. Was on a 150 run & it didn't seem too smooth at 65mph. Played with the VFClll as I was riding [no traffic] G=4 smoother but Instant MPG jump up. G=5 mpg dropped, G=4 mpg jumped, G=3 mpg dropped, G=4 mpg jumped. Got home and pulled the plugs and they were BROWN. Didn't think I'd ever see brown plugs on the Vision. They Have alwas been Black or White. My real MPG was 42, [all interstate[ & in town It jumps to 47. You see 50mpg @ 50mph in 5th a lot on the wish meter in town most of the time. But when it gets really hot out 95+ it has a little stumble off idle like its rich. pulls off Idle with no gas & no stumble. 5th gear a 35 is still smooth. I excellerate softly from that speed. |
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Power loss troubleshooting
