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Visionary
Posts: 3204
Memphis | Hey nuz, This is a Clearwater thread. If you think you are talking anyone into Martins because you can't afford Clearwaters and don't like the looks, you are probably kidding yourself. Start a Martin thread and try to influence people that way. |
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Visionary
Posts: 1229
Rancho Cucamonga, CA | Halogens? How classic. Maybe I should trade my Vic in for a Harley while I'm at it. But then, even HD is smart enough not to mount halogens to front fenders.
Clearwaters are not for everyone, just those that want a longlasting lighting system that outperforms halogen in both durability and output.
Now, if you want to make a case for HIDs, we could have an interesting conversation. Costwise, they are less (until a pair of bulbs burn out), they put out more light (unless you go Krista LEDs), but will never match the durability or reliability of LEDs.
Beauty is in the eye of the beholder - I own a Vision.
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Puddle Jumper
Posts: 28
Basehor, Ks. | I thought this was a discussion. Not a condemnation. If you like the BMW, get the BMW. Park it in front of your house so everyone can see how loaded you are. I am not kidding myself, I've seen them both. Try driving at night with your headlight out using LED's. C'mon , cut the sarcastic remarks. LOOK INTO the Martin Fabrication lights and kit, and compare. If you like Allen screws in plain view, then by all means spend the money. Just because I own a Vision(not new) doesn't mean I have to put the cat's meow on it.
Thanks, Allen |
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Visionary
Posts: 1359
New Bohemia, Va | thenuz - 2011-03-10 6:59 PM
Hello fellow pregnant "Mothers". Has anyone even tried the lights from Martin Fabrication? Are we all just trying to justify the exorbitant expense? Please spare me the diatribe. Have you ever had your headlight go out in the middle of Texas at night? Nice to have the halogen to get your butt to the nearest shop. The Clearwater lights are butt ugly and look like they belong on a tank or an adventure bike. I'm sure you are all proud that you agree with yourselves. I have seen them, and I don't want them on my Vision. But they would look great on my John Deere Riding mower...Peace
Eat your own words.... |
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Visionary
Posts: 1229
Rancho Cucamonga, CA | It's always good to have as many options as possible when accesorizing a bike. It keeps the prices low and the quality up. I never pass up the chance to look at something else that might do the trick. Most of us that have considered driving lights are aware of the multitudes of companies that make halogen and HID lights that range in price from $40 to $800. I agree, the Clearwaters are expensive. I did not want to spend as much money as they were asking and that was why I started this thread. Many won't even look at the Clearwater's because of the price, but comparing it to brands where you are paying just for the name and nothing else is, well, unjust.
So what makes one light cost 3x more than an other? and who would pay that if they weren't just looking for the most expensive farkle to put on their showcase?
Let me go through some of the thoughts in my head when I applied for paypal credit so I could get these instead of ones I could have just paid cash for.
Having come from Harleys, I was well aware of how much light halogens put out, and they would do an ok job if my main headlight gave out - but I wanted something brighter.
I have discussed with many riders, dealers and bloggers about driving lights, and none of them recommended mounting halogens on fenders. The vibration and jarring kills the fillaments at a ridiculous rate. Reliability was my second requirement for the lights.
These two things pretty much pushed an inexpensive soultion to my lighting needs out the window. I did consider mounting lights up in the fairing, but just couldn't find a decent spot that would give a good seperation to the lights and add to my ability to be seen as well- the third requirement for the lights. I couldn't see buying cheap lights just so I could turn around and buy marker lights as well.
If the Vision had big engine guards like the XC or Harleys for mounting lights to, I could have gotten away with halogens and lived with the lower light output and occasional bulb replacement. It might have been worth the saving, at least in the short run. Maybe a better system would come out in a few years even cheaper. Who knows?
So, with halogens out of the picture, I was left with $350 for HIDs or $424 for LEDs.
HIDs put out tremendous amounts of light and have no fillament to break. This was starting to sound like the setup for me, but it had it's drawbacks also. Being so bright, you really couldn't leave them on all the time without pissing off the people around you. I want to be seen, but not seen as the a$$#%!& biker.
Not only would I have to run a relay to the battery (not a big issue), but I would have to find places for ballasts close to the lights (again, not a big issue). Bulbs would still burn out and vibration and jarring still reduces it's lifespan (not nearly as bad as a filliment bulb).
So, what does LEDs and another $75 get you? Definitely not just a Nike swoosh.
A light brighter than halogen (but not as bright as HID) - 1st priority.
A light not affected by vibration or jarring that will last longer than the bike - 2nd priority.
Can be left on all the time and dimmed when needed - 3rd priority.
Bonus features;
- super easy install
- low amp draw
- don't have to remember to turn them off before I start the bike (HIDs hate to be turned off and on repeatedly)
- will go full bright when I hit my highbeams or horn (this actually fits into priority 3, but not a dealbreaker).
Was asthetics a priority for me? No, but they blend in so well on my bike, you don't even see them. Only the massive amounts of light they put out. The allen bolts you see are no different than the allen bolts that were there to begin with. I have yet to see a mounting bracket that is functional and good looking (Martin included).
Expensive, Yes.
Better, Yes.
Met all my priorities, Yes.
Throwing money away, No.
Yes, saving money is a priority too, but buying something that would not meet my other priorities WOULD be throwing money away.
Edited by Nozzledog 2011-03-12 4:42 AM
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Cruiser
Posts: 162
Northern NJ | Let's face it, as LED technology is improving traditional bulb lights are going the way of the corded dial telephone.
I replaced enough expensive bulbs in PIAA running lights to justify the cost difference with the Clearwaters.
As good as PIAAs are, the Clearwaters blow them away.
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Iron Butt
Posts: 623
| just to add to the discussion......Moto lights. : ) just in case you wanted to try them. Had these on my bikes for the last 11 years. Great customer service, great product. easy install on the vision. I know the clearwaters are a good product too, the Martin lights?.....i dont know, but i doubt they are on par. |
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Visionary
Posts: 3204
Memphis | The cool thing for me about Clearwater is they actively sought us out when the Vision was first released. Tarpits99 posted a thread that Clearwater was looking for a Vision to make a prototype set for back in Dec 7 of '99. On Dec 10th, rldr12 posted that he had talked to Clearwater and they seemed a little pricey and he'd wait. On Dec 11th, (after a couple of more posts) he made another post saying they had been installed and he included a picture (four days after the original Tarpits post!). After that, the ball was really rolling. For me, personally, the Clearwaters have nothing to do with "image". It was an opprtunity to support a small company that wanted to support the Vision culture early on with a world class product. Even the guys who don't like the looks know better than to bash their quality. They will probably outlast my bike. The best way to get a "deal" is to organize a group buy. For those newbies who haven't followed the whole Clearwater story, it started here: http://www.vision-riders.com/bb/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=4881&posts=91&start=1 |
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Visionary
Posts: 1229
Rancho Cucamonga, CA | thenuz - 2011-03-10 4:59 PM
I have seen them, and I don't want them on my Vision. But they would look great on my John Deere Riding mower...Peace
(VicDeer.jpg)
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Iron Butt
Posts: 742
North Orange County CA | Is that the 60" deck option? I thought about getting one, but decided it would make lane splitting an impossibility.
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Visionary
Posts: 1359
New Bohemia, Va | Wow! Absolutely cool! Is that a 2012 model, or is that an aftermarket deck? I could kill two birds with one stone, ride and cut grass. But you didn't show us what it looks like with the clearwaters, so it is slightly off topic. |
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Tourer
Posts: 576
, IA | so with all this BS no one came up with the answer to the ??????? Best price and where to buy thanks a lot for all that great info LOL |
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Puddle Jumper
Posts: 38
Galt California | Talk to Glenn 916.852.7029 clearwaterlights.com |
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Visionary
Posts: 1229
Rancho Cucamonga, CA | Pashnit.com was the best I found. $424 w free shipping. |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 742
North Orange County CA | thenuz - 2011-03-10 6:59 PM
Have you ever had your headlight go out in the middle of Texas at night? Nice to have the halogen to get your butt to the nearest shop.
The Clearwater Glenda Lamps augment and improve the the Vision's lighting, but I wouldn't buy them, or any other driving lamp, as an emergency light source. I would consider that to be a real waste of money.
The Vision comes stock with two headlights, and a great many of them have the optional HID headlamp, I would argue that the need for a set of halogen driving lights solely for the sake of redundancy is pretty minimal.
A simultaneous failure of both these factory systems signals an electrical cataclysm of such magnitude that even the spare relay and fuses I carry in my trunk probably aren't going to cure it.
Back to the original topic - $424 with free shipping from Pashnit.com appears to be a great price. Our original Group Buy , in Dec of 2009, was $400 (including shipping); with fuel surcharges and cost increases over the last couple of years that seems a pretty fair deal.
Get em now, before the free shipping goes away. I ship product by UPS every day and the rates have become insane. |
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Puddle Jumper
Posts: 40
Kansas | So the deal is to call Glenn and metion membership to our site for the group pricing? |
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Visionary
Posts: 1229
Rancho Cucamonga, CA | It hink the group pricing is gone, but they may still give a discount for VR members. I don't know if they will beat the Pashnit.com price. Theirs worked out to 12% off and free shipping. |
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Best price on Clearwater lights?
