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Cruiser
Posts: 69
AZ | Thank you 1atom12, that's what I thought.
regards
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Puddle Jumper
Posts: 19
| 1Atom12, I seeu have Lloydz cams on your bike. When the cam was installed, weren;t u provided a map from lloydz? 2nd question - If you were provided a map, why did u go with the autotune module? 3rd and final question - Did u feel a difference between the "before" the install of the autotune compared to the current map you had with the cams and "after" the install of the autotune? Your answers are appreciated  |
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Puddle Jumper
Posts: 19
| Any of you guys with the autotune installed, do u have any pics how it was installed? |
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Tourer
Posts: 311
Atlanta Area | northeastleds - 2010-06-27 9:21 AM 1Atom12, I seeu have Lloydz cams on your bike. When the cam was installed, weren;t u provided a map from lloydz? 2nd question - If you were provided a map, why did u go with the autotune module? 3rd and final question - Did u feel a difference between the "before" the install of the autotune compared to the current map you had with the cams and "after" the install of the autotune? Your answers are appreciated Lloydz map did not include auto tune tables. It also did not include separate fuel tables for front and rear cylinders. Webhair and I basically had to start from scratch and create a new map which included auto tune tables and front and rear cylinder fuel tables. When Kevin did our cams, he only installed the PC5, not the auto tune. Webhair and I installed the auto tunes about a week later. Night and day difference between the Lloydz VM-1 map and what the auto tune did and continues to do. To Lloydz credit, he has his own fuel management system that he is trying to promote and it works beautifully. However, my personal opinion is there is more potential with PC5 with auto tune, just do the math. Add fuel, subtract fuel, add timing, retard timing, free rev extend to 6K, auto tune trimming. If you are thinking of just installing the PC5 with Lloydz VM-1 map without auto tune, go with the VFC3 instead... The VFC is simple, proven and works awesome...
Here is a pic of where we installed the auto tune modules. DynoJet's website has Vision-specific instructions for the PC5 install with pics
Edited by 1atom12 2010-06-27 10:14 AM
(auto tune installed.JPG)
Attachments
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 auto tune installed.JPG (85KB - 8 downloads)
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Tourer
Posts: 311
Atlanta Area | Here is a pic showing the stock Harley AT-100 plug cut off and tapped into the switched 12vdc power under the seat access cover using blade connections:
(auto tune power.JPG)
Attachments
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auto tune power.JPG (70KB - 6 downloads)
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Tourer
Posts: 311
Atlanta Area | Front and rear wideband 02 sensors installed:
Edited by 1atom12 2010-06-27 9:58 AM
(front jug wideband.JPG)
(rear jug wideband.JPG)
Attachments
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front jug wideband.JPG (87KB - 6 downloads)
rear jug wideband.JPG (53KB - 7 downloads)
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Puddle Jumper
Posts: 19
| Thank u for the great pics and the informative answers. This post should help a lot of members out including myself. |
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Visionary
Posts: 2300
Georgia, west of Atlanta | really good to see info coming in from all angles. |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 669
Peachtree City, GA | 1atom12 is correct LLoydz has built an awesome product with the VFCIII and it works very well. He has spent a lot of time developing and perfecting it. However a end user can only adjust the lower middle and high ranges of it.
With the PCV a person or tuner can adjust the fuel table for the RPM and throttle position in 250 RPM increments and 5% throttle increments. And if your really eager to go for it you can do it for each gear (I am not that eager - yet).
Lloydz map is set up as most tuners would. one fuel table for both cylinders. I believe it is because of using the sniffer in the exhaust pipe and the way the Vision pipes are set up. If someone close to DynoJet would take their Vision in to them with the VM1 cams... They could build a map for you that would tune each cylinder. I believe you have to have the correct equipment and pull each of the two O2 sensors to build the map... (There are not too many tuners that would do this or have all of the equipment).
You can also set up a timing table which Lloydz maps does and I believe that is needed for the cams. One of these days I will ask Lloyd but work keeps getting my way...
The Auto Tune modules it appears to work as advertised... you can set up targeted AFR ratios for each cylinder (in 250 RPM and 5% throttle increments) and then it will trim the fuel tables to adjust to the target. Does it work???? I think so, but I am from Missouri and you have to show me.... The jury is still out.
Any wrench will tell you... each bike is a little different. With this set up it should be pretty close to what is needed for that bike....
Now - someday I do plan on having dyno'd to find out for sure, but for now the bike is running very well. I still need to verify the mileage increase but the bike's on-board system is reporting 3.3 mpg increase.
I am blessed enough to have two Visions - both set up with VM1 cams. One with a VFCIII and one with the PCV.... We will see which one I like better as time goes on... (of course that is if I can get the 08 away from my wife...)
Another feature is that you can add a LCD module to the PCV that will store additional maps and you can switch them on the fly. I have not added the LCD to my system because the tech at Fuel Moto did not think it is really much more then a nice toy type item and was not worth the money yet... A little too expensive for me to play with - but I might some day...
So it is really just a choice... VFCIII simple sweet and easy to work with - PROVEN or a more complicated device PCV that can be tweaked incrementally.... Do you want to just ride and know it works well or do you want to experiment and play with the hopes of finding the perfect (not going to happen) tuning for your bike...
Edited by Webhair 2010-06-27 8:33 PM
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Cruiser
Posts: 69
AZ | Called Fuel Moto on Monday. They are shipping out the AT100 unit with a return shipping label to send back the AT200 unit that was originally sent to me.
Having the PCV and AT100 installed on Saturday...looking forward to it.
regards
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Visionary
Posts: 2300
Georgia, west of Atlanta | What would be the correct Power Commander with auto tune for a '08 Vision ?? ..........Thank you............ |
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Tourer
Posts: 446
East TN | XRsteve - 2010-06-30 12:15 PM What would be the correct Power Commander with auto tune for a '08 Vision ?? ..........Thank you............ PC-V and AT100...not sure of the map as it depends on YOUR CURRENT configuration! |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 810
| PowerCommander's web site indicates these are for 2009 and 2010. Has anyone tried them on a 2008 ? Thanks, Tim |
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Visionary
Posts: 3773
Pittsburgh, PA | If u read the previous posts your see this was asked a few times already. But to give u a quickly. YES it does work. |
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Visionary
Posts: 2300
Georgia, west of Atlanta | Thanks everybody, this has been a good posting............. |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 810
| Great, thanks, sorry for being lazy. You would think that PC would update their website especially if they are loosing sales over it. Tim |
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Visionary
Posts: 3773
Pittsburgh, PA | I personally talked to chris with power commander, and he said the reason they didn't list the 2008 models are because all the tests were done on 09 models etc. He actually want me to report to him how my install went and how it worked on my 08 model... the customer support from them is tremendous! I asked so questions and they never were rude and always were helpful.. |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 669
Peachtree City, GA | XRsteve - 2010-06-30 5:44 PM
Thanks everybody, this has been a good posting.............
+1
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Visionary
Posts: 2300
Georgia, west of Atlanta | Webhair: I live out in carrollton, who do you use as your main dealer/ service person. I bought mine down in Columbus and have been utilizing the Kennesaw store for parts, oil, filters and service. Kennesaw is 55 miles and Columbus is like 75 miles are there any closer ?? |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 669
Peachtree City, GA | For the most part - I use my garage and do most of my own work. Things that I don't do (not much) I usually will go to Cummings. There is also King Custom Cycles in Fairburn. The owner, Phil King use to be the service manager at Blackjack before they closed.
Anything Major - Gainesville, FL (home of KevinX)!!!!
I have bought parts from both Cummings and Kennesaw but usually will order on-line from Surdyke motorsports or Maxim Powersports at a 20% discount.
I'll PM you my cell number and we can talk more... Actually I am off tomorrw and a few Vic owners and I will be playing in the garage... |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 810
| I looked at their Vision map set and nothing is close to my setup. What did you use for your initial map configuration? I also see the PCV has various [0-5] volt inputs. Do you know which ones work with the Vision?
Thanks, Tim
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Iron Butt
Posts: 810
| marcparnes - 2010-05-30 6:50 PM I leave mine in Autotune mode all the time. I don't know what the advantage would be to switch back to the base map. Maybe someone else might have an idea. ... Marc I was reading one of the HD forums about the PCV and one reason for 2 maps was a lean high mileage map and a rich "cooling" map for stop and go traffic. Another possibility would be a performance map and a "smog-check map" if they start smog checking bikes =).
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Iron Butt
Posts: 810
| Arkainzeye - 2010-06-26 4:50 AM i hope the PC5 has a feature where you can set the (first 60 seconds OR MORE) to be more rich of a mixture.. I read the PCV software manual and it appears you can configure a startup map to run either by time or temperature.
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Iron Butt
Posts: 669
Peachtree City, GA | I have mine configure to have a 60 second start up delay before reading the O2 sensors... There is no temp sensor on our bikes that I know of - but have not dug into that end of it.
As for the map. My base map is one that Lloyd provided with the VM1 cams. Then the Auto Tune modules adjusted it from there...
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Iron Butt
Posts: 810
| Webhair - 2010-07-06 6:17 AM I have mine configure to have a 60 second start up delay before reading the O2 sensors... There is no temp sensor on our bikes that I know of - but have not dug into that end of it. As for the map. My base map is one that Lloyd provided with the VM1 cams. Then the Auto Tune modules adjusted it from there... Thanks for the info. In need to get mine functional so I can take it to DynoJet to get a specific map for my configuration made up. I looked at their map set and they do not have any published maps close to my configuration. Sincerely, Tim |
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Power Commander V and Autotune
