golfer - 2008-05-20 12:46 PM Oh, and by the way, I will take you up on that bet! Unfortunately for you, I will be in a 2006 Dodge Viper just to make sure I win the bet.

Well, I just happen to have a 2006 Dodge Viper that I race. I'm willing to take you up on that bet too. Since you have a viper, do you do any of the Viper Days race events (http://www.viperdays.com)? You can check some of them out on my youtube at http://www.youtube.com/viperfergy. I'm doing Hallett in OK June 5-8. I also race in the Skip Barber race series in open wheel (Formula Dodge) and I'm a member of Motorsport Ranch (http://www.motorsportranch.com) where I track my car once or twice a month.

Breaker - 2008-05-20 12:55 PM Fergy's got it right on the physics and the gyroscope effect of the the motorcycle and how it actually turns. I think everybody in the thread is saying the same thing, just using different wording. I believe the MSC teaches the counter steering "press down on the right bar to go right - press down on the left to go left" for a couple of reasons. One, if a new rider thinks that grabbing the bars and turning them is how to corner and steer, they are setting themselves up for disaster at some point. They'll panic and give those babies a good twist. Secondly, if they believe they are leaning the bike to steer they once again are going to have problems. If they come into a corner hot leaning is not going to cut it. We are pushing (counter stering) even if we are not concious of the fact. The way to get out of a corner is to accelerate and push those bars - but that's very counter intuitive, especially for a new rider. David Hough writes some great books that I've come to read over and over. Proficient Motorcycling and More Proficient Motorcycling. Conter steering, delayed apexing on the corners, and general survival skills on the bike. Well worth the read if you get the chance.

I've been told that before by some of the instructors. Personally, I want to know what it is I'm doing and not only know what an instructor is willing to tell me to "protect me from myself." This is serious stuff and knowing what it is you're actually doing vs. hiding the fact in the hopes you don't kill yourself sounds liberal politics to me. Not you; MSF. There are rare but important moments when on a bike and knowing how to swerve is one of the most. It needs to be instantaneous and second nature. It is with me but I'm not sure about a lot of others. I've seen numerous accidents because of these kinds or problems and riders of 30 years still thinking that you turn a bike by leaning. Plus, if you just try turning gently while going down the road, you'll get the feel very quickly. It's actually hard to turn the wheel very far but a little goes a long way and knowing the feeling will save lives.

golfer - 2008-05-20 1:01 PM NO!!!!!!!! You have to be on your Vision!!!! I would be in my buddies Viper, lol... Now, when is this race? On a seperate note...I watched a special on some channel that had superbike vs. supercar on a closed track with twisties and straight aways...I assumed the bike would clean up, but the car edged it out every time. They said the advantage of the car is the braking, and the bike had the advantage of acceleration, and I thought they said the cornering was negligable...So, that is why you would need to be on the Vision, and me in a Viper. Because I know that the Vision is no super bike, but the Viper is darn close to a super car...

Not a fair contest. I already know I can go faster in my viper around corners than I can on my bike. Of course, you may suck as a driver in which case I would beat you anyway but I don't know that for sure so I'd prefer to keep like hardware. A car has an advantage in a number of ways. We have sportbikes at MSR as well as open wheel and sport bikes are fast but lose time in the corners and overall their times are slower than sports cars and sports cars are slower than open wheel. Just the way it is.

I'm ready when you are.

sorry for yanking chains. my hope is that all riders have many, many years of happy (s)miles on a bike. the destination is about the journey when riding. every rider, before riding, needs to  have a full understanding of what they are getting into. I have advised old men like myself who want to ride to get a small, used, but dependable bike and take a MSF MSC beginners before getting too deep. Ride it like you're a little old lady (no offense meant toward little old ladies) for about a year. Then if you still like riding, get the bike you want. When I started riding again after 20 years, I got a GL1200 and rode it for two years before getting the Vision. Every ride I am vigilent to all that is around me and will back off at the first sign of cager problems. I don't ride when I have a heavy load on my mind or if I'm not feeling well or medicated. That don't sound right, but I'm sure my wife would want to medicate me at times; I'm only speaking of OTC cold medicene or the such. Yes, I know it is counter-steer to turn the bike and not leaning. But leaning is the fun part and is the most prominent to the rider and the observer, so it is what we think we are doing to do what we do. Everybody, just know what you are doing when you ride. If you don't, get that way because we all want you to be around for a long, long time. And besides, none of us could stand the thought of a smashed up Vision...

golfer - 2008-05-20 2:13 PM I practice many avoidance techniques often. The one I really work on while just going along with nothing else going on is fixation. Probably my weaker skill. So I will see something that is not a hazard, but treat it as one. Like a manhole cover. I just try and lock in a path around the object instead of staring at the damn thing like is instinct with me. I have found myself hitting small roadkill because I will see them and stare at them. I realize hitting small game is not a problem, but when it is a larger object I will be screwed if I can't pull my eyes off it in time. Countersteering is another I practice most. My girlfriend gets pissed at me because I practice it with her on back. I tell her it is for her own good. The bike handles so much differently with a passenger. I like to practice my moves 2 up as well...

One of the most dangerous things on a bike is "target fixation". I've read a few articles on this and seen video's from riders who got caught up in it. It happens too many times in a right hand turn with traffic in the opposite direction lane. What ever you do don't look at that truck or car, look at where you want to go, your lane, around the corner. This may be argueably the biggest killer, other than intoxication or speed for condition.

This seems to be the hottest topic so far.

golfer - 2008-05-20 1:13 PM I have found myself hitting small roadkill because I will see them and stare at them. I realize hitting small game is not a problem

We should call you roadkiller or or varmit hunter instead of golfer.

varyder - 2008-05-20 1:26 PM This seems to be the hottest topic so far.

Let's start an oil thread. That seems to generate the most responses in the groups I belong to.

varyder - 2008-05-20 1:56 PM I hit an oil patch from an accident on a right turn about a month ago. The way I slipped around the corner, it had to be AMSOIL because it definetly didn't break me down, nor did I run hot.

Ok. Since you brought it up. What Amsoil are your running? I've heard good things about it and I'm due for an oil change. Do you run 20w50 or is there something special?

wrr1home - 2008-05-21 12:46 PM I changed mine to Amsoil 20w50w, before my trip this past weekend to Cherokee & Deals Gap. The wrench said that the clutch may slip using this oil. After around 1100 miles this weekend, I have noticed no slippage, and quieter valves and smoother shifts. What an awesome machine!

Well Bill, I don't think you're part of the hijacking of this thread about oil, since you were at Deals Gap scraping boards and more. By the way, does AMSOIL carry the chrome filter for the 106? or did you get that at Catlin's?