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Cruiser
Posts: 271
Belding Michigan | I took my bike into the shop for the Brakes and these are the things that followed.
The Good My brakes are fixed and working well according to the shop.
The Bad My rear tire was down to the wear bar in one place from bad cupping and this at 6600 miles. I am not happy tires should last longer than that if not I am going to go broke in a hurry as my summer trips are usually 6500 miles that means tires twice a year. OUCHHHH!!!!
The Ugly the tire replacement reccomended due to the weight of the bike with my weight was to go back to the E3 Tour Elites and with Labor it is $650 to replace them both and the bike has been in the shop for 3 days when it is 65 degrees in Michigan for the first time this year so I did not get to ride it and it is supposed to snow this weekend. WHINE!!!!! |
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Tourer
Posts: 482
Beer Collins, Colorado (there is no fort) | The two tires can be had for $310 http://www.compacc.com/p.cfm/c/2009007/p/12493
that leaves $340 to put towards a nice motorcycle tire changer http://www.nomartirechanger.com/products/2
I actualy enjoy rollin' my own and it has paid for itself quickly, especially when your friends/neighbors have bikes too. It usually takes me a couple of nights to get a pair done w/new bearings but I take my time and I do have a back up bike if needed. |
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Visionary
Posts: 2118
Pitt Meadows, BC Canada | I have 17,000 km (little over 10,000 miles) on mine going into it's 3rd year. (much of year 1 summer I was not riding due to heart problems) and I am still on original tires. Plan is to replace them this spring.
Co-pilot is almost always with me, and together we weigh about 350 lbs, and our roads are curvey and up-and-down.
I'm thinking that maybe 3 factors account for premature tire wear:
1. Straight and flat roads - if not much curves and hills, you're always using the bottom of the tires - not much of the edges.
2. Temperature - we don't get 'hot' days - hot pavement will cause excess wear.
3. Riding Style - agressive will wear faster
I wouldn't expect much more than 10,000 miles out of tires on a bike weighing 1200-1300 lbs (with riders & load).
Now pricewise - I just got off the phone with my dealer - $950 (plus sales taxes). And our $ is at par with U.S. YIKES !!!
Difference turns out to be that we actually pay our mechanics REAL wages here - which could account for the fact that my mechanics have done a good job on everything I have needed - and I haven't heard any gripes from other bike owners about shoddy local dealers either.
Brian - how much will you charge me??? And do I have enough rubber on my tires to get to your place?
Or do I put the $1,000 plus the SPCSHP towards buying a new Vision? Just rambling on .... waiting for some sunshine....
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Iron Butt
Posts: 1117
Northeast Ohio | I put on Bridgestone Exedras and the rear tire is only rated at 74 (827 lbs). I found a sticker under the radio and it says the bike calls for a rear tire capable of 907lbs. The 80 weight rating on the E3 is the ONLY tire in our rear size that is capable of that weight, unless you want to run darkside (car tire). 80 = 992 lbs.
Needless to say, I am taking off the Stones and going back to E3s. I bought my E3s off of BikeBandit.com. With 10% off because of a AMA membership, $7.95 shipping, I got the tires to my door for $286. I have not found a website in the past month that even comes close.
amessen, my dealer wanted $600+. I talked them down to $550 installed when I was looking at the Stones. They charged me $125 for install and I am going to do this again. Going to wait for my angled valve stems and swap them out. |
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Visionary
Posts: 2118
Pitt Meadows, BC Canada | My bike: 1300 lbs / 2 = 650 lbs per tire. I KNOW - that is biased, but still - I don't think I am putting 900 rear/400 front. That would make for some FUN riding..... |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 721
| ScoreBo, I think you might be getting some wrong information. BOTH the Dunlop E3 and the Bridgestone G704 tires have a load rating of 74H (827#) according to the info I got from http://www.totalmotorcycle.com/photos/tire-tyre-guide/Dunlop-Elite3... and http://www.totalmotorcycle.com/photos/tire-tyre-guide/Bridgestone-G...
The only Dunlop E3 with over an 80 rating is the 250/40R18 size with a load rating of 81V (1019#) and the next one down in 180/70R16 size has a load rating of 77H (910#)
Keep in mind that the Vision uses exactly the same tires that will fit a Honda GL1800 Goldwing. Some of the best deals I've come across on the internet for tires is Directline Parts at http://www.directlineparts.com/byProduct.asp?prd=Tires&str=4 |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 1117
Northeast Ohio | Travelin Man, I wish I was wrong. Here is a link to Dunlop. I wish it wasn't the case as I hate the tire noise from the E3s and love how quiet the Stones are. http://www.dunlopmotorcycle.com/tirecatalog_tire.asp?id=91
Don, our bikes have a maximum gross rating of 1414 lbs. This is straight out of the owners manual. With the Stone setup, I am rated for 1427. When I was installing the CB this past weekend, I came across the sticker under the radio. I don't remember what front specifically said, but know with 100% certainty the rear said 907 lbs. I know from an overall perspective that i am good. But the last thing in the world I want is a blowout riding 2-up. 865 wet weight of the bike, 250 for me geared up, and 140 for the woman. 400 lbs for rider and passenger. This only leaves 427 lbs for the rear of the bike, including anything in bags and trunk. Not worth risking for a few hundred bucks.
Edited by ScoreBo 2010-03-18 11:31 PM
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Iron Butt
Posts: 1117
Northeast Ohio | Don, I should explain more. What we don't know is the weight distribution of our bikes. Using total weight divided by 2 isn't 100% accurate. I wish it was as my problem would be solved.
Travelin Man, while it is true that the Wing uses the same SIZE tire, it is apparent that the Wing has more weight over the front tire than ours. I think our bikes are better balanced and this will put more weight on the rear. If you ride solo all the time, you could do a weight rating of 74 and be good. I don't and this is where the problem lies. |
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Visionary
Posts: 2118
Pitt Meadows, BC Canada | John - I don't know, nor care (in my case). I LOVE the handling, and tire wear is NOT a problem.
I would not even think about changing to some other tire (but for $1,000 will consider buying from HONDA).
As I said - "biased" meaning - I understand that it is not 50/50 front/rear - but I also understand that the stock tire is able to handle anything I can throw at it (experience proves this) - so why argue with what works? At least for me....
As I said - your conditions are likely FAR different from mine - so all I can say is "I feel your pain" - but I really am thankful I don't.... |
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Visionary
Posts: 2118
Pitt Meadows, BC Canada | Gawd, I gotta be sober to think about this stuff..... sorry, but I'm in a 'party' mood. Gotta go find the Co-Pilot.... bye..... |
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Visionary
Posts: 1350
| One other thing can contribute to premature tire wear. Air pressure. Perhaps a bad gauge or the tires were not set properly at time of sale?
I have 16,000+ on my original tires. They are still legal tread and the front has minor cupping. I need tires but plan to powdercoat my rims at that time.
Owning a full tourer is not a cheap thing. |
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Visionary
Posts: 1340
Gainesville Fl Home of the Gators | Cupping of the rear tire is caused by not having the proper inflation in the REAR SHOCK |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 721
| John, you are correct as to the Dunlop website which makes me wonder, I've been using the Dunlop E3s since they came out in '05 and I know that when I originally ran them on my Wing they had a 74H load rating, is it possible Dunlop upgraded the rating simply to out do the competition or did they actually re-engineer the tire to carry the higher load ratings. This is something I am going to have to look into some more.
The actual load ratings aside, it still goes that the tires that are designed to work for the GL1800 Goldwing should work just fine on the Vision as both bikes are similar with their weight bias front to rear as you would be surprised at just how heavy the Freedom V-Twin engine and transmission are due to their heavy construction because they are used as a stressed member of the chassis. Think about it for a minute, take all the plastic off both bikes which doesn't weigh all that much and you will be left with very similar weights as the total weights for both bikes are within 2 pounds, 890 pounds for the Vision and 892 pounds for the Goldwing. The Vision frame adds the forward and centralized mass that the engine lacks compared to the Goldwing's flat-six engine/transmission which by the way weighs only 535 pounds. |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 721
| Kevin, I know exactly what you are talking about as this had been discussed in the Goldwing forums many times with many riders not having the proper pressure or pre-load on their rear suspensions. I'm a big guy at 6'1" and 320# and riding mostly solo (my wife rides her own bike most of the time) I usually have my rear suspension set between 65 to 70 psi. (tour with trunk on). I am fanatical about checking tire pressures (too much time spent around a GWRRA chapter I guess) daily and always run at 38 psi front and 41 psi rear and I usually get around 15K to 18K miles out of a set of tires, I could get more out of the front usually but I like to change tires in sets. |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 1117
Northeast Ohio | donetracey - 2010-03-19 1:56 AM
I also understand that the stock tire is able to handle anything I can throw at it (experience proves this) - so why argue with what works? At least for me....
Understood and 100% agree. I certainly don't want to thread hijack, just want to inform fellow riders that if you are concerned about the weight rating on your tires, the E3 is the ONLY option available today. |
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Tourer
Posts: 482
Beer Collins, Colorado (there is no fort) | "if you are concerned about the weight rating on your tires, the E3 is the ONLY option available today."
Not true- The Avon Cobra's are available & have the same load rating.
http://www.motorcycle-superstore.com/3/31/401/14173/ITEM/Avon-AV72-...
Edited by ByteN2it 2010-03-19 9:11 AM
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Cruiser
Posts: 271
Belding Michigan | My problem is being bigger than the average bear. I have to look hard tire ratings I am normally over the GVR of the bike all by myself and add any stuff for a trip and my wife well lets just say the bike has a right to grunt.
I am 6'10" tall and 400 lbs with riding gear on about 450 they killed serval large cows for my jacket which I am proud to say my wife had made for me. She is 130 and 5'1" (remember dynamite come in small packages) but with 75 lbs of stuff for a trip we are at 655 lbs at least and that is over the weight rating so I depend on my tires to help take up the slack.
I check the tire pressure and I keep the shocks full all the time so the wear is from just the weight overall.
I would buy a bigger bike but they don't make one yet. I also don't want a trike so I guess I will have to live with it but it is expensive. Archie |
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Visionary
Posts: 1484
LaPorte,Tx. | According to Metzler, Bridgestone, and Avon company websites all of their tires, the ME-880, G704, and Cobra, 180/60HR-16 tires are load rated at 74. The Dunlop company website lists the 180/60HR-16 E-3 at a load rating of 80. The rated lbs. at 41 psi for a 74 is 827lbs., the rated lbs. at 41 psi for a 80 is 992lbs. I'm not sure, but you could possibly use a 180/70HR-16 E-3 the Vision, which is rated at 910 at 41psi, this is a load rating of 77. I'm going to take some measurements to see if I can get this tire to fit. It has a reduced load range, but it is larger in diameter which should reduce rpm at a given speed. Plus, the thread depth is 1/32nd deeper which should give more miles. |
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Tourer
Posts: 400
| Isn't there a thread about a guy who switched over to a car tire? |
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Tourer
Posts: 377
O'Neill, Nebraska | You might want to shop around.
I got about 15k out of my rear tire and the front is doing well.
Rode the bike a lot in 100+ degrees last summer and kep the air pressure in check.
You might want to shop around on the tire replacement. Our Vic dealer was running a special and I got the rear tire with mounting for $250. It was the Dunlop E3. |
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Tourer
Posts: 482
Beer Collins, Colorado (there is no fort) | I retract my previous statement- the E3 is the only tire I'm seeing with a 80 load rating-my bad |
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Iron Butt
Posts: 1117
Northeast Ohio | IndyVision - 2010-03-19 7:37 PM
Isn't there a thread about a guy who switched over to a car tire?
Indy, I mentioned it in my first reply. 
What we really need is is 17" rear wheel option. I ride with a friend who has a BMW 1200 LT and he is running a factory rear rim, 17", with a Metzler Marathon ME880. Looking at the sidewall, it has a load rating of 81 (1019 lbs). This would also open up the door for other manufacturer sizes of tires.
I have searched high and low for our size tire that has an 80 load rating. Trust me folks, there isn't any and VisionTex summarized it nicely.
Amessen, Here are your options:
1. Run the E3s at max pressure ALL the time. Load ratings are ALWAYS based off of max pressure (as VisionTex said).
2. Go Darkside with a car tire on the rear. Folks that switch swear by it. Jury is still out if I like it. I have concerns with leaning and rolling it over on the edge as the tire is more square than a MC tire.
More detail---
Our bikes weigh 852 lbs with fluids (http://www.polarisindustries.com/en-us/Victory-Motorcycles/2010/Touring/VISION-TOUR/Pages/specifications.aspx# - choose chassis dimensions).
852+650=1502 lbs. The GVWR from the same page above is 1414 lbs, so you are over from a chassis standpoint, but that is less of a concern for me. They typically over engineer chassis', so I think that is ok.
Based off the weights, with the 80 load rated E3 (992 lbs w/ max pressure) rear, the GAWR (901 rear and 513 front - pic below) leaves an additional 91 lbs of tire (901-992= 91lbs left over for rear where most of your weight concerns are going to lie - some will go to the front). You are 88lbs over the GVWR of the bike, but have 91 lbs left over on the E3. So you are 3 lbs to the good. This is assuming ALL of your weight, gear and woman unit are over the rear. I would guess that 70% is.
In summary, you NEED to run the E3 as the ONLY MC tire option at max pressure all the time (I do too) or run a car tire. I highly recommend the TireGard Tire Pressure Monitoring System for $161 from cruisercustomizing (http://www.cruisercustomizing.com/detail.cfm?model_ID=0&Category_ID=0&manufacturer_ID=66&product_ID=32710). This will allow you to be on top of the tire pressures. I am running this and LOVE it.
I feel like I am writing a research paper for college!
Hey! Victory Motorcycles! If you are looking at this thread, please either:
1. Work with a tire manufacturer to give us a higher load rated option than 80.
2. Sell us a 17" rear wheel option so we can chose a tire manufacturer that offers a load rating of 81.
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Visionary
Posts: 4278
| As I was reading I was thinking of getting 2 bathroom scale and setting the bike on them to see where the weight is.
I have gone to the car tire store and had them put in nitrogen. If you look at the late model cars you will see green valve stems and that is for the dealers to know that there is nitrogen in them. Nitrogen leaks out slower. Are garage air compressor puts out about 74% nitrogen air.
The slower it goes out the better. Buy the way you should not have to pay for the air but I tip the guy cause I no I am coming back.
QUESTION would those tire beads make a tire last longer???? |
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Cruiser
Posts: 101
Cold Lake Alberta Canada | Dark Side! Do the research, check it out.
I love it.
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The Good the Bad and the Ugly
